BNP on BBC

by Michael Thu Apr 21, 2005 23:36

The Conservative Party's race card campaign is as racist as the BNP's, except it's done with a bigger budget.

by Comedy Fan Fri Apr 22, 2005 12:32

"NO FREE SPEECH FOR FASCISTS"

always makes me giggle! The irony! The hypocrisy! The biggest thing both extreme left and right wing ideologues have in common is that they believe the general public must be controlled. Of course, they'll use words like "protected" and "prevent them being conned" but what they really mean is that individuals can't make up their own minds and no dissenting view must be tolerated which would poison their feeble minds.

And then the extreme left and right wonder why the people won't vote them into power? Ha! This comedy is just divine!

[oh, and set your watches folks.. how long before somebody who advocates free speech is denounced as a right-wing infiltrator?]

by zeppo Fri Apr 22, 2005 13:04

No I don't think you're a right wing infiltrator, just wrongheaded.
As a socialist I advocate free speech. And while I might find the opinions of the GW Bushs, Blairs, Berlusconis and McDowells of this world objectionable, and would be happy to protest against them I don't believe they should be prevented from speaking.
You, like many other people live in a universe where the "extreme" left and right are somehow analagous and reasonable people live in a happy hunting ground in the middle which is populated by bunny rabbits.

When groups like the BNP peddle their vile, irrational hatemongering, people get hurt, and killed.

And while socialists deny free speech to the far right, the far right if given the opportunity, would take it away from everybody else, even you. The irony of being a liberal....

by Sherlock Holmes Fri Apr 22, 2005 13:07

The point of having no platform for fascists is that their views result in violence against ethnic minorites. You can check the statistics from all across Europe, where fascists increase their votes there is a direct link to increased violence against ethnic minorities in those areas. The right to free speech is linked to a responsibility to use that right in a constructive manner. If you abuse that right and incite racial violence, then that right must be taken away. Now you no doubt are white, and as such fascists do not incite violence against you. If on the other hand you were living and working abroad and there was fascists, or indeed people who are just racist, inciting violence against Irish people, you would be singing a very different tune. So think a bit about your comment here, and the next time you read in a paper or hear about attacks against minorities think about your defense od free speech and your resultant compicity in that violence.

by comedy fan Fri Apr 22, 2005 15:03

Yes, well we have incitement to hatred and incitement to violence laws which cover that ground.

Funnily enough, we also have laws prohibiting violence and any racially-motivated violence tends to be dealt with more severely by the Justice System

So what we're left with is expression which is legally allowed yet obviously of an objectionable nature.

So are we to deny them legal rights which we grant to others? Who makes the decision as to who has their legal rights and who has them taken away from them?

You? Who are you to make that decision? To subvert the legal rights fought for so dearly for centuries....

And what's with the "bunny rabbits"... I said I was a comedy fan NOT an animal lover!

by Sherlock Holmes Fri Apr 22, 2005 16:04

If you had done your research you would have discovered that are incitement to hatred act is utterly useless. There has only been one conviction under it which was subsequently overturned on appeal. The guards stopped long ago trying to convict someone under it. Lawyers have ignored it as irrelevant for years. As for your "fought for centuries" diatribe, give me a break. Do you honestly think that people fought and died against injustice only to have injustice perpetrated in their name. It is also patently obvious who the laws would be directed against, those that incite hatred. If you don't know who that means perhaps you should stick to comedy and stay out of the real world. Again my point stands, if it was you who was on the receiving end you would be singing a very different tune. However, i have no doubt that you will continue to have your head buried in the sand.

by juan pablo Fri Apr 22, 2005 16:08

and i have to say it was pretty awful, it was poorly made confused on message and overall quite amateur and confusing, i doubt the BNP won many supporters out of it.

by tristan Fri Apr 22, 2005 16:16

I wish I didn't have to be the person to point this out (as I don't like the BNP), but the public face of the BNP never incites violence or advocates extreme measures (even if they do privately).

by MG Fri Apr 22, 2005 16:46

Most recent report only two weeks ago!

BBC News
Tuesday, 14 December, 2004, 18:59 GMT

BNP head Griffin bailed by police

The leader of the British National Party has been released on police bail after being arrested following the screening of a BBC documentary.

A party spokesman said that Nick Griffin, 45, had been held on Tuesday morning on suspicion of incitement to commit racial hatred.

Mr Griffin said he believed his arrest was "politically motivated".

Three men have been charged with racially aggravated harassment as part of the police inquiry into the BNP.
The party's founding chairman, John Tyndall, was also arrested on Sunday…

Etc., Etc.

+++++++++++

BNP men bailed in race case

Dilpazier Aslam
Friday April 8, 2005
The Guardian

The leader of the British National party, Nick Griffin, appeared in court yesterday charged with four race hate offences.
Mr Griffin, 45, was charged by West Yorkshire police after a long-running inquiry into the BBC documentary The Secret Agent, which broadcast clandestine footage of BNP activists.
No plea was entered at Leeds magistrates court over four counts of using words or behaviour intended or likely to stir up racial hatred in two separate incidents on January 19 and May 5 last year.

He was joined in the dock by the party's founder, John Tyndall, 70, who is charged with two of the same offences.
Also appearing was Mark Collett, 24, of Rothley, Leicestershire, who was charged with eight race hate offences.
All three were granted bail by district judge David Kitson to appear at Leeds magistrates court on May 19, where they will be committed to crown court for trial. The men face up to seven years in jail if found guilty.

Etc,. Etc.

+++++++++++

by tristan Fri Apr 22, 2005 17:02

That's what I'm trying to say buddy. Possibly in your rush to anger you misread what I had written. The BNP have been exposed many times as being virulently and violently racist. But as your quotes say, the footage is usually "clandestine". The BNP take great pains to portray themselves in PUBLIC as being common-sense moderates.

by barra Fri Apr 22, 2005 18:29 aranu21 at hotmail dot com

the e-mail i received from the bbc in reply to my complaint is quiet disturbing anyone else think so?
Should these people have a right to be heard?
NO they give simple answers(?) to complex problems we got to learn from history REFUSE! RESIST! fascism where ever it shows its hate
free speech? how much would they give us

by Jon Glackin Sun Apr 24, 2005 20:13

Just in case anyone has any illusions that the BNP are a 'respectable' party now.. I recommend people check out this link..
http://www.searchlightmagazine.com/stopthebnp/uncovered/pg06.htm

The BNP – the ugly truth

 The BNP has terrorist connections
David Copeland, who carried out the London nail bombings in Brixton, Brick Lane and Soho said: “My aim was political. It was to cause a racial war…then all the white people would go and vote BNP.”

 The BNP is a fascist organisation
Mark Collett, the BNP’s former youth leader, was caught on TV praising Hitler and saying that Nazi Germany was a better place to live than Oldham or Burnley.

 The BNP and racism
BNP leader Nick Griffin and John Tyndall were arrested in December on suspicion of incitement to commit racial hatred. When the BNP get elected, racist attacks increase.
In Burnley – where there are 6 BNP councillors – 237 racist attacks were recorded between April 2002 and March 2003. This is an increase of 149% from April 2000 and March 2001 and corresponds to increased BNP activity in the area.

 The BNP denies the holocaust
Six million Jewish people were murdered in the Nazi holocaust. In total 15 million Jews, trade unionists, gypsies, Slavs, black, lesbian, gay and disabled people were murdered as a result of Nazi Germany’s murderous policies. Nick Griffin was convicted for inciting racial hatred after a magazine he published denied this.

 The BNP is full of people with criminal convictions
Several leading members of the BNP have criminal convictions. The Secret Agent documentary showed BNP members openly admitting to racially motivated crimes.

This is the real BNP

by Radical Mon Apr 25, 2005 13:39

The evil capitalist fascists at the BBC are promoting the BNPs agenda as a means to draw the working classes attention away from their true place at the bottom of the Means of Production and the true cause of Socialism. This is in order to let their exploitative capitalist fiends of friends at New Labour totally subjugate the left and assert their new evil hegemony of ideas.

by Sherlock Holmes Mon Apr 25, 2005 14:23

As an anti racist activist i have received many death threats from fascists, as indeed have many other anti racist activists in the ARN and RAR and other similar groups. Many ethnic minorities on this island have been under physicial attack, both verbal and physical, from fascists aswell. While the number of fascists on this island are small, it does not require large numbers for attacks to take place. Someone like you has no comprehension of fascists in Ireland, what they stand for, or indeed what their activities are. So make jokes all you want, they are neither funny nor acceptable. But thats all people can expect from you now, isn't it?

by comedy fan Mon Apr 25, 2005 14:54

... let me get this right. If THEY were in charge, people wouldn't have the freedom of speech [with the caveat that we not break the laws regarding incitement to violence or incitement of hatred] which we take for granted.

So, why are you proposing just that course of action? Doesn't using their tactics make YOU as bad as them?

by Sherlock Holmes Mon Apr 25, 2005 15:07

So comedy fan, i see you still have your head buried in the sand. I will repeat what i have said often. I explained earlier that our incitement to hatred act was utterly useless and is not enforced. I then pointed out that you, being white, were not the target of fascists. I also talked about the rights and responsibilities of free speech. I pointed out that there is a direct link to the rise in fascist activity and attacks on ethnic minorities all across Europe. Please read my previous posts carefully and follow the instruction to stick to the comedy.

by Socially aware Mon Apr 25, 2005 16:15

There are thousands of unreported racist murders all over europe directly encouraged by the evil far-right organisations. They have increased by several times over the last few years. The government are more interested in appealing to the evil racists who vote for these parties to bother tackling this very real problem!!!! They should all be arrested and not allowed to stand for election. Anyone proven to vote for/ support the BNP should be sacked and arrested or at least publicly humiliated.

NO FREE SPEECH FOR FASCISTS!!!!!

by DV8 Wed Jul 20, 2005 12:25

BNP founder Tyndall dies aged 71

British National Party founder John Tyndall, 71, has been found dead at his home in Hove, Sussex police have said.
A veteran of the right-wing fringe of British politics, Mr Tyndall chaired the National Front, leaving in 1980.

He was due to appear in court this Thursday in Leeds alongside BNP leader Nick Griffin on race hate charges.

Sussex Police said there were no suspicious circumstances surrounding Mr Tyndall's death which was reported at 0815 BST on Tuesday.

A spokesman for the BNP said Mr Tyndall had been expelled from the BNP twice but added he was an "excellent chap with a keen analytical mind".

"John was a great fellow who knew exactly what our movement was about but it is fair to say that he was not able to carry that forward to electoral success," the spokesman said.

Mr Tyndall founded the BNP in 1982 and was replaced by Mr Griffin in 1999.

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