Shutting nightclubs even earlier

by Sunil Mon Sep 27, 2004 02:43

Hi people,

As some of you may be aware this is a serious week for Nightclubs in Ireland. Reports in the Sunday Independent today have told of the Gardai's plans to have the closing times of nightclubs reduced to 1.30 a.m. It seems they are going to court with the proposal on Wednesday, and if passed will obviously mean very bad news for the clubscene here. Please spread the word and contact your local representatives and media.

Many of you will be familiar with the whole situation here but for those of you who are not:

The Gardai's issue with the official closing times (currently 2.30 a.m., sometimes a little later) is that more drink related public order offences occur the later clubs leave their doors open; a theory which has yet to be substantiated in any way. Last year the government moved the times back from 3 a.m. to 2.30 a.m., so if published figures from the last year that detail a 2.65 BN euro government cost for "drink related problems" are to be believed, then their 30 minute cutback could most easily have contributed to the problem rather than have helped it. It's no secret either, that the Gardai would rather not have to police the streets at night as much as they are currently required to (maybe there are too few of them deployed to the streets, who knows?) and earlier closing times for clubs will, they think, make everyone's life a lot easier.

It's obvious that this new introduction will cripple the clubscene here; pubs and clubs have already been badly affected by the smoking ban, and this current proposal will be another nail in the coffin if it's passed.

Anyway, the finer details could be discussed for ages and I don't want to bore you!
If you are against the Garda proposal please please spread the word and contact your local representatives and media.

Cheers,

Sunil

by Socialist Mon Sep 27, 2004 14:42

We need to defeat the drink industry in Ireland which is poisoning the minds of young people and the working class with the propaganda of slave labour and bourgeoise hegemony.
Rather than being involved in radical politics and revolutionary action against the state organs rather we are being brainwashed by multinationalist corporate advertisements selling the capitalist notions of materialism and excess at the expense of the oppressed.
All nightclubs should be nationalised and regulated. Enforcement of the law and control of the means of production should alleviated the alcohol problem in Ireland combined with re-education programmes as mandatory in our schools.

by White Elephant Mon Sep 27, 2004 15:58

Socialist seems to want a total ban on alcohol. Or if this isn't available, the state should be able to dictate who drinks what and when.
Perhaps he should setup a kibbutz and charge an annual fee. He can then play god and decide who gets to get drunk on a particular night, or not as the case may be.
For my part, I'll continue to spend my money in the way that I want, and not worry about some loony with a notion of Utopia among the working classes. The government do not own me. Nor do you.

by curious Mon Sep 27, 2004 16:27

Surely this person is taking the proverbial? MInd you considering how tiresome most totalitarian socialists are in person I would not at all be surprised.

by Anorak Mon Sep 27, 2004 17:21

"In both the city and village the opinion is held that 'a member of the Communist League of Youth may not drink'. This is an achievement that must be strengthened and developed. You will frequently encounter a windbag who with a look of profundity will start explaining that the struggle against alcoholism is Tolstoyanism. It is hard to imagine anything more stupid or banal. For the working masses the struggle against alcoholism is a struggle for physical, spiritual, and most of all, revolutionary survival. We have barely began to raise ourselves up. We barely have enough to make do. We can raise our wages only very, very slowly. And indeed wages are the basis of everyday life and the basis of cultural progress. Forcing its way into the daily life of the worker, alcohol snatches a large share of wage earnings and in this way undercuts the advance of culture. It is necessary to clearly understand the full extent of the dangers of alcohol under our conditions, in which the country's economic organs have hardly begun to recover after a dangerous illness and everywhere still carry traces of chronic disease. The worker correspondent must be able to intimately relate the struggle against alcoholism to all the conditions of life of a given group of workers, to all their factory, cultural, and domestic circumstances. And any worker correspondent who takes alcoholism lightly, when it is the most malicious enemy of the revolution and of the cultural advance of the masses, is not a real worker correspondent."

"But, Comrades, in this struggle [the abolition of illiteracy] we have another fierce adversary whom we must overcome if we are able to advance. I speak of alcoholism, of drunkenness. Various forms and methods of struggle against drunkenness have been tried and will be tried in the future. But the basic method is to bring about the cultural progress of the masses themselves, to develop in them a stubborn fighting vanguard in the battle against alcoholism.

"In this connection, the first place must be taken by the women, and of course the worker correspondents must make their contribution to this movement. The period that lies ahead must be a period of heroic struggle against alcoholism. The working masses still live very poorly, but nevertheless not so poorly as in past years. We can observe a weariness of the nerves, both from the revolutionary upsurge of the recent past and from the present revolutionary lull, which demands stubborn everyday work. People's nerves are badly worn. There is a great demand for different sorts of stimulants or, conversely, sedatives. The demand for alcohol, for intoxicating, artificially stimulating drink, is very strong among the workers in the towns.

"And, Comrades, the worker correspondent who sets a bad example in this matter is not worthy of the name of worker correspondent. A worker correspondent must be a fighter against drunkenness. This is no laughing matter. History will subject us to a hard test in this matter. If we do not give a rebuff to drunkenness, starting in the towns, then we shall drink away socialism and the October Revolution

by curious Mon Sep 27, 2004 17:40

So murdering tens of thousands of people after the fashion of Saint Leon is better than having a few pints. That's "cultural advance" I suppose?

by mushroom man Mon Sep 27, 2004 18:11

The prospect of nightclubs going out of business is of little concern to me, munchkins.

Because there's nothing I like better than a trip to the woods, a tent, some friends and a bag of mushrooms. There's some lovely variants for you to try all with their unique types of audial and visual halliucinationary personas.

You can get to know them personally, and soon shrooms begin to take on a rare and wonderful persona all of their own. You are at one with yourself and nature and live in a wonderful, spiritual world of melting colours and talking flora.

Ah, those endless autumn eves when we would sip mushroom tea, as they did of old, and knocksink wood morphed into an ancient, verdant garden of delight. One felt akin to a wandering Inca seeking the sun-god of manu picchu.

So, tarry not in these grey streets and loud, vacuous bar-rooms, but come with me my munchkins where will will roam free as gods of the earth!

Blessed Be, For Now, My Munchkins.

by Leftwing drinker Mon Sep 27, 2004 19:11

"So murdering tens of thousands of people after the fashion of Saint Leon is better than having a few pints. That's "cultural advance" I suppose?"

Does this mean the Anarchists support the profit driven promotion of alcohol abuse? Surely I thought Anarchists would support measures that would bring nightclubs/pubs etc under communal ownership and control

by curious Mon Sep 27, 2004 19:16

I can assure you that I am not an anarchist!

And yes, I would far rather have some individual publican running the place that I drink than some committee of totalitarian marxists.

by raver Mon Sep 27, 2004 20:29

I think the death of clubs is long overdue. Sick of paying for overpriced pints and over-rated DJ's playing the same old crap (sorry Sunil but you're still a young'un relatively speaking!)

Bring it back into the fields and quarries... no more fucking Smirnoff Ice or Red Bull banners hanging over you while you're off your face.

by Akrasia Mon Sep 27, 2004 20:56

People who want to do their drinking outside of the establishment (presumably with home brewed spirits) should support the campaign to keep the nightclubs open.
The tragedy of the commons would dictate that all the best spots would be ruined if the usual clubbers took to the hills and valleys as a substitute.

I don't go to clubs very often (mainly because the only clube near me are really shit) but the fact that they're there gives me more options than if they weren't, and I am not arrogant enough to presume that my hobbies and interests are something that everyone should be forced to engage in.

It's not either or. There should be an underground scene In Ireland, but such a scene would not survive if it was under the fullbeam focus of the state military machine.

by pc Mon Sep 27, 2004 20:57

first a bit on online petitions?? more then 2,000 people have signed this one in 24hrs :) not bad

Richard Brophy says:

"an online petition is one of the best if not the best way to express serious and organised opposition to a proposal by the goverenment and its agencies, ie the cops. Recently, the government weren't bothered that Irish would not be an officially recognised language in the EU, so some Gaeilgoiri got an online petiiton together and gathered over 40,000 online signatures. The result? The government are now in turn petitioning the EU to make Irish one of its official languages, which in itself will create more employment - eg translators for Irish EU documents, speeches etc.

Similarly, there was an online petition on www.ticeidi.com about the Ticketmaster booking charge per ticket transaction. The result? The ticketing industry is currently being looked at by the Compeititon Authority. Online petions clearly pack a serious
amount of politicial clout."


--
media

(by all accounts Gerry Ryan had a poll this morning and over 90% were opposed)

The Last Word with Matt Cooper will be covering this issue at 5.15pm this evening

gwilliams

I've just been speaking to the Department Of Justice.....
Apparently they aren't introducing a new law, but just re-enforcing an existing law from the Intoxicating Liquor Act 2000, which enables the Garda to prevent a pub/club receiving a Special Exemption Order. This SEO has to
be sought every month from the courts for anyone who wants to open later than 1.30. The garda have always had to power to object to these SOE, since the 1920's when the state was formed.
There is no official press release yet, but the guy I was talking to said he would speak to the press department and ask them to send out a press release.....
So basically the garda are being more forceful in objecting to premises that have trouble associated with them.....
I was assured that there was no change in the law to take place on Wednesday....."

----

Yeah Robbie Fox of Renards was on Today FM this morning regarding this and gave this info: (as you have probably heard before) there is actually no such thing as a 'nightclub' in Irish law. There are only pubs and pubs with exemptions. Nightclub owners must pay for (and I think apply for) the exemption every month - I think he said this costs ?170 for each night the exemption applies (ie every night they want to stay open past 1.30) which when added to solicitors' fees, he
estimates costs approx ?225 per night or ?70,000 a year. From one club. That's a lot of money to the exchequer. Which also stands to lose the revenue from the tax on sales of alcohol between 12.30 and 2.30. I would say this is the most realistic argument against early closing and is the most likely reason this hasn't gone through up to now, as Finance make the real decisions.

Forums
Keep involved with whats happening on forums like
ie-dance (www.yahoo.com/groups)
Novadance (www.novadance.com/boards)
Clubbing-ie (www.clubbing-ie.com/forums)
Peoples Republic of Cork (www.peoplesrepublicofcork.com/~peoplesr/forums/)

some people are saying that it has more to do with guards wanting to go home earlier then anytihng else or the guards trying to highlight their (clear) lack of resources by raising unpopular ideas to the public to get the minister to do something about it...

proposal to go to licensing court on Wedneday?? at 6/7....

by Steve Mon Sep 27, 2004 23:30

Personally I can't stand nightclubs but of course there are a lot of people who love going to them for some unfathomable reason. I'm all for choice and diversity, so this, like the smoking ban before it, annoys me. What makes the government think they have the right to tell us when to go home to bed, as well as treat us as if we're too stupid to look after our own health? What do they gain from denying people something that doesn't cause any overall loss to anyone (and it's even stranger considering the amount of revenue they make off alcohol)?

The next government - I hope - will be made up of people promising to repeal all these ridiculous over-the-shoulder laws. Hopefully not the Socialists though. Ugh.

by jh Tue Sep 28, 2004 20:18

from the irish time today In a further blow to the industry, Mr Ahern reiterated his commitment to reducing licensing hours. He claimed it had never been his intention to have clubs still serving drinks long into the early hours and said it should not be condoned. I have no problem with moderate drinking and people enjoying themselves,? he said. But now there are several places which seem to be open not only into the early hours of the morning but into the late hours of the morning. That was never my intention. I am reliably told by young people that there is no difficulty in getting a drink at four or five and six o?clock in the morning. I don?t remember passing that Act and I don?t think it?s a good thing either.?Reports at the weekend suggested new laws were being considered which would put a 1.30am cap on serving time in all pubs and clubs. But in what may come as a relief to young drinkers, Mr Ahern conceded that to have one generic closing time was practical and would not work. There are something like 50,000 people moving out of Temple Bar on a Saturday night and obviously to have that all in one go is a pressure on gardai and on public transport,? he said. ?But that?s not to condone staying open until five or six in the morning.?

by jh Tue Sep 28, 2004 21:07

does anyone know if this will go before a judge per venue?
I assume each venue will get a review to renew there licence ?
Do the gardai not have to show that a venue is causing a probblem ?

Is this why every cop in dublin had a small digital video camera on them outside practically every premisis last weekend ?????

Anyone else notice this... all of us outside traffic gave a good wave...

--

i think the best person to contact is ciaran cuffe td of the green party who is in favour of later club opening along the lines of mainland europe. ttp://www.ciarancuffe.com/ perhaps the petition could be sent to him to bring to the attention of the dail?

the media support has been excellent so far. on newstalk yesterday it was covered by sean moncrieff, damien kiberd and george hook. it was discussed on the panel on rte last night and covered at length on eamon dunphy this morning.

--

Was listening to 98FM this morning and the online petition was one of the
news pieces- they said that there are nearly 5,000 signatures!
Impressive....

--
band wagon jumping this, but needs must..

STATEMENT BY SENATOR DEREK MCDOWELL
Labour Party Senator and Representative for Dublin North Central,
Tuesday, 28 September 2004

PUNISHING CLUBBERS IS NOT THE ANSWER TO LOWERING ORDER OFFENCES

Senator Derek Mc Dowell, Labour Party representative for Dublin North
Central, has today voiced his opposition to any proposed change in the
licensing laws that would see night clubs close at 1.30 a.m.

"Although there are still problems with drink related public order
offences in our towns and cities, we must ensure that the vast majority of
people who go out to have a drink, a dance and to socialise and who don't
cause trouble, are not penalised because of the behaviour of an unruly
minority.

"We have to start treating people like adults and respect their right to
choose. I can't think of one European city that refuses its adult
population the option of going to a nightclub. In fact, it's the norm.

"Moreover, the current model whereby some sequencing in terms of when pubs
and clubs close is far better than throwing people out on to the street at
the same time from a public order point of view.

"Uniform closing times will only result in thousands of people trying to
get a taxi or nitelink or fast food at the same time and hence increase the
potential for trouble.

"Going back to the restrictive opening hours of old is not the answer. It
will hurt the nightclub trade, engender justifiable anger and resentment
among the law abiding public, and potentially increase the problem
of public order offences on our city streets."


ENDS

For further info please contact Senator Derek McDowell at 01 618 4312

www.labour.ie/press/

--

Do you think earlier nightclub closing will lead to a
reduction in public order offences?
28% YES 72% NO

--

with the online petition reaching 8,00 signatures in two days one hopes it will reach 10,000 by weds..

it has been difficult over the years to set up any sort of clubbers are general punters association to give voice to all the late nighters about but a group is now being set up to treat this issue as serious as it is and had a brief meeting yesterday...

by john Tue Sep 28, 2004 22:45

what is the address for the petition?

by Y Tue Sep 28, 2004 22:51

No point in posting the petition here. It is against the editorial guidelines. Try phoning up one of the nightclubs affected.

by eeekkk Tue Sep 28, 2004 23:15

.

by pc Tue Sep 28, 2004 23:27

if thats the case and there's enough of story here anyway...

http://www.petitiononline.com/mod_perl/signed.cgi?night269&7451

hmm i see duplicate signings or something about of save sammy campaing?

but heres a selection of what people have written

I believe that closing nightclubs earlier will just drive people to start drinking at 5 or 6pm instead of 8 or 9pm. It will not change anything, it will just move things forward to earlier. Yet another ridiculious proposal to sweep things under the carpet.

Well lads, here's the lesson. It doesn't go away when you sweep it under the carpet, you need to come up with a solution, not a sweeping brush!

Staggered Closing times should be trialed. Early closing times will cause moere hassle and violence, all at the same time. What

difference does closing at 1:30 or 3;30am make? Its unfair to the niteclubs to close them early.

I think the law wouldn't reduce the number of public disorder etc but give a huge damage to Tourist industry

seriously , 3 oclock is too early as it is, nevermind 1:30 , sort it out......

I think this will drive the whole clubbing scene underground and raves and beach parties will be on the increase because of this.

This is another tactic for legislation to do the work for the Gards. You want to tackle crime? Start making arrests.

drunk and have no sense of how to behave. There is also an abdication of personal resonsibility. Changing attitudes to enjoying
alcohol responsibly will address the root causes far more effectively that depriving people of social outlets.

dont do it....it would suck donkey balls

This will not solve any issues except better shift hours for Gardai. All arguments aside closing down a capital city at 1.30am is
embarrasing!

Ireland needs more trully cultural events and education. People don't know very basic cultural things. And the empty void gets filled up with alcohol

I work as a nightclub bouncer, and do not believe that closing hours of clubs would decrease public order offenses.

A dedicated club license, with staggered closing time based on the maximum occupancy of the club would be a much better alternative

p.s. Dustin for Taoiseach - at least we know whats up his ass!

by Al Wed Sep 29, 2004 00:26

Regardless of the closing time being 1.30am or 6am the result will be the same. Like one poster has already said, people will just start drinking earlier.
In Ireland we have a drink culture, this needs to be adressed instead of reducing opening hours. One idea would be too have a maximum time allowed IE 4 hours in the boozer but thats not going to happen for obvious reasons. I believe alternative entertainment has to brought in, I mean what do you do on a Sturday night? Hit the bar, thats it in this country and the attitude with most in there is "Lets get hammered". That has too change. I rarely drink now because of what I see on Saturday night but Im in the minority.
As for Gardai making more arrests, is that the answer? Arrest everyone? If we did that were accused of being nazis.
As for Gardai shifts, the bar could close at 6am, we still work the same hours, we work 24/7 not just bar hours, try thinking before posting.
And finally, Mr Doorman, would you be one of those people that refuses people because you dont recognise them? Or maybe because they arent regulars? Or how about the guy that refuses to speak directly to people or even make eye contact? Or are you one of the very few that will refuse people that are blind drunk? Does your premises remove people that are blind drunk? As the law requires. Christ, its a bad state of affairs when a failed wannabee with a power rush is deciding such things.

by Boozer Wed Sep 29, 2004 12:43

I think it's intersting that on a site with a so many posters of an allegedly libertarian persuasion, that no-one has made the following point: If I want to drink, it's my business. If I want to drink too much, it's my business. And if Ireland, has a drinking culture, then that's Ireland's business.

Fighting outside a nightclub is already a crime. Being drunk and disorderly is already a crime. If people are commiting these crimes, they should be dealt with accordingly. Those who are quite peacefully getting plastered should be left alone, even if they are displaying "an unhealthy attitude towards alcohol". It's not the state's job to make people people healthy if they don't want to be.

by pc Wed Sep 29, 2004 18:42

Someone who contacted the PDs sent me this on, their response...

Thank you for your mail. It is important to stress that the decision re the closing time for night-clubs is one for the gardai in conjunction with the local district court, and not for the Government or the Department of Justice.

However, Minister Michael McDowell did raise concerns on today's News at One
regarding this proposed 'blanket' closing of nightclubs at 1.30pm.

The Minister said that he would be consulting with the Attorney General
regarding how the current law on the Statute Books should be interpreted. He was
of the view that, each case should be looked at individually, and that clearly stated reasons must be given if a nightclub is to be refused a late licence. He never imagined that a blanket approach to the licensing situation be taken.

Thank you for contacting the Progressive Demcrats directly on this. I hope this reply is satisfactory

by pc Wed Sep 29, 2004 18:56

"I just heard from someone who was in court and they did not object but the percieved wisdom is they might on friday when the annual licence is up and or Monday??"

we've now gone live with the site. tis a bit rough'n'ready but we'll be adding/sharpening things up over next few days.

as you may have seen, the petition we set up has reached over 13,000 signatures ( as of 16.40 Wednesday 29 Sept), with little or no advertising, or media attention, just word of mouth. also, in the space of less than 3 days , that is quite a staggering number. Our aim is to get that number as high as possible , as quickly as possible , in order to present to the Gardai and also the overnment the magnitude of displeasure at the recent proposals to curtail nightclub opening hours.

We are looking for people to help us the signature list up as high as possible and you can do so by ...

1) letting people know about the website and the petition

2) following some of the links on the website and get in contact with various people in the press, politics, civil service agencies and the
gardai.

3) we have posters ready that can be put up all over town and in colleges.
Anywhere really that you can think of. if you can help put a few up , please do . They'll be made available from Selectah Records from approx 5pm Wednesday 29th September. we'll also have a downloadable version of the
poster up later tonight.

4) Many people dont use the internet or have an email address so you can also download a pdf.file from our site (www.giveusthenight.com) to get written signatures. Again you might know someone who's involved in the nightclub business , or indeed feel passionately about it yourself. Every signature helps.

5) We'll hopefully have about 10,000 flyers ready by Friday, so again if you could distribute them in colleges around town etc please do. Again these will be made available from Selectah records.

Basically we're doing this to help clubs ALL over Ireland , so the more people who help out, the better the momentum we get, and the more influence we will get - it needs to have a snowball effect.

so let as many people as you can know about the website and the petition, and lets keep at it....

cheers,

by jeff Fri Oct 01, 2004 17:06

My kid sister sent me the link regarding the online petition set up by Sunil. This was yesterday and I was mad.

But of course it turns out to be stupid ugly rumour ggone out of control. How do I know this? Because last night I was drinking in the Living Room in Galway till 2.30 am.

However, it is alwas good to stay on top of things and there is nought wrong with a litttle panic from time to time. It is a healthy thing for us otherwise docile Irish.

In the meantime, I hope that some posychotic unreformed bootboy skinhead tracks down the Socialist ponce who posted earlier on this thread and gives him a good kicking. Move to Iran, you twat.

Oh, mushroom guy. Get a grip, man, psilocybin is a wonderful visionary drug in rare and small doses, but prolonged use will make your head soft. So go easy in that tent of yours.

As the line of verse goes ; "A Pint of Plain is yer only man." Guinness is the best, no hangover and a slower scoop due to it's creamy texture. I've only recently converted at 27, after years of abusing cannabis, lager, and, pre frost season, yes, indeed, mushroooms. Iron( as extracted from the hops) beats THC, sugar and psilocybin any day of the year ( except Christmas day, and Halloween).

That is just my opinion. Unlike Socialist , I do not believe you all need to be phsyically prevented from using that which is not the best for you. Enjoy yourselves, but be good to yourselves also.

Slainte.

by slight boozer Fri Oct 01, 2004 19:03

These changes are probably going too far, but I think some restrictions are necessary.

"If I want to drink too much, it's my business". If hospitals are full of drunks with various complaints then this IS a problem that affects everyone, not just the person who wishes to drink loads.

"Fighting outside a nightclub is already a crime". But if drunken violence reaches a level where people are regularly getting beaten senseless (innocent bystanders incl.) then that is wrong.

Other countries have more responsible and relaxed attitude to drinking. They say we could have the same within a generation. A generations a long time!

by pc Fri Oct 01, 2004 22:17

I just heard on the radio that the Gardai didn't oppose any late licence applications, except those applying to serve until 3.30 (Spirit for one).

i think just venues with theatre licences got held back and that's until
2.30 so not too bad i suppose. everywhere else is as was though i think ???

Taskforce to examine antisocial behaviour in Dublin
30/09/2004 - 18:03:20

A new city council taskforce will examine how best to end antisocial
behaviour and crime on Dublin's streets, it emerged tonight.

The Commission on Crime and Policing, set up by Lord Mayor Michael Conaghan, will examine how to battle increasing threats to law and order across the city.

Mr Conaghan formed the group in a bid to identify solutions to crime and policing problems in the capital with members asked to focus on public order, anti-social behaviour and drug and alcohol abuse.

The 11-strong group will present its initial findings to the city council in December 2004.
Mr Conaghan said the aim of the commission was to influence the final
stages of the new Garda Bill due later this year over new roles for local authorities in crime and policing.

Invitations have been extended to the general public and to community and social organisations to submit written solutions to the problem of anti-social behaviour in Dublin.

Written submissions must be made before October 15, and the Commission has the support of both Justice Minister Michael McDowell and Garda Commissioner Noel Conroy

from iol
----


Court orders clubs to stop serving at 3am

01 October 2004 16:16

The Licencing Court has ordered nightclubs to stop serving drink at 3am at the latest, in a bid to reduce public order problems in Dublin.

The President of the District Court, Judge Peter Smithwick, granted Garda applications to reduce opening times for nightclubs using theatre licences.

Some clubs had been able to stay open until 3.30am or 4am because of this +loophole.

Under the new conditions, normal nightclubs will stop serving at 2.30am and theatre-licenced premices at 3am.

by pc Fri Oct 01, 2004 23:38

Hi all

Due to Garda restrictions

Spirit will be serving until 3am tonight and every night we are open
until further notice.

All music and dancing must end at 2.30

We invite our guests to stay and finish their drinks at their leisure


--
Seems to me that its the typical tactic of threathning someting really bad &
then when they do something less offensive people are relieved.

by Al Sat Oct 02, 2004 00:47

Just too clarify 2 points. 1. Female officers, while in the minority, are in high positions.
2. Gardai retire at either 57 or after 30 years service, not 65.
The fact that Spirit is closing roughly 1 hour earlier is hardly the biggest upheaval in history now is it? I mean its only one bar and the vast majority of people leaving probable should have stopped drinking way longer than 1 hour ago (Thats the people that have stayed with drink only) . I have alrwady stated that I dont believe it will make a difference but who knows, maybe I will be proven wrong. I think the fast food joints should be targeted more as there is far more violence outside them.
As for being drunk and disorderly and assault already being a crime, well. I can only speak for myself but I know I would rather the person was removed from the situation than arrested after kicking the shite out of me. Say what you will about your freedom to drink but you have to admit that when it comes to alcohol we are far more immature than most other nations.

by Paul Kinsella - Various Sat Oct 02, 2004 18:54 paulkinsella53 at yahoo dot com 53 Lorcan Grove, Santry, Dublin 9, Eire 085-1478100

What about people who work late Al? People like bus drivers, restaurant staff and security people amongst others. They often don't finish work until well after 12 Midnight. Shouldn't they be allowed to have a few drinks as well; or would you rather deny them their right to relax after a hard night's work? Remember some people do actually work Al? Rather than being the magic cure to our problems all this will do is throw yet more people onto our streets at the same time with all of the problems that this will cause. People will still drink the same amount; except that they'll drink it earlier and quicker. The solution is staggred hours like they have in continental Europe; and eventually Ireland will be dragged screaming and kicking into this much more sensible regime despite the protestations of the politically correct brigade.

by Leon Mon Oct 04, 2004 10:10

Spirit claimed to have a theatre license but a look at the fringe theatre listings shows nothing for them.

It was a scam and not only should the owner lose this privelege he sould (and will) be shot as part of a global revolution bringing about the end of capitalism.

by LaYkE Mon Oct 04, 2004 18:46 pete at webworld dot ie

I am one of the many "I drink yet I don't vandalise, I don't steal & I most certainly don't start fights". Why should I have to deal with this 'quick fix' when the majority of people are fine?

Now there are 2 things that concern me more then anything. Might I add the first reason has a prime example; America.

My first point being, drungs. Lets face it lads, it costs me €200 for a night on the town, yet it's commonly know you can purchase ecasty tablets for €3-10 anywhere and the effects last a few hours. A bag of cocaine costs roughly €100, so which is more attractive to Timmy who's 18 and out for some fun fun fun?? Look at the US, Alco is too hard to get but I guerentee it's piss easy to pick up crack there. I fear this will happen here too, wait... I forgot it's already well in here.

The Second reason, and the one that will effect most of us; taxes. WTF are we going to do with the big tax hole thats made up of our drinks? More stealth taxes? A 3rd bin charge? Next year, I can see our tax rate at 22% maybe 23%.... Although Corporation taxes will probably remain at 6% but thats ok, it's big biz!! It's Joe bogger who has to pay up.

Frankly lads, drink has been cut out a bit in pubs but it didn't stop the scoby bast**ds getting drunk, smashing all the bus shelters and stealing my mates car from the front of my house last Saturday did it?

Personally, I have a strong dislike on Bertie and his reign of Terror. I can't wait until his term is up. Watch FF lose more seats then ever.

Also as for anything being state owned... not too sure I like the Idea of a government dipping into my personal life at all.

Bertie :: Viva la Dictatorship!

by pc Wed Oct 06, 2004 01:30

ok so some of the places were stretching the licenses but that was the only option to get clubs open late... the judge said the only interest the nightclub owners had in staying open was to make more money well im happy to pay them money if the club stayed open later there was a doctor i think on from galway today on primetime who kept saying there was evidence, terrifying evidence even, that there was binge drinking and violence occuring, but a nightclub owner rep (different from the association?) countered that by saying there be a 10% drop in slaes of alcohol from nightcubs and a huge increase from off licenses... so whos to blame and whats that go to do with closing down clubs earlier anyway? apparently a licensing bill is coming out in two months which will have a actual nightclub license but will shut them at 2:30???

by 4hydroxy Wed Oct 06, 2004 14:44

some would say yer mad...but yer the only one talking TRUTH. Socialists? Anarchists? Booze as an issue? ask me lad

by Al Sun Oct 10, 2004 01:25

What about people who work late Al? People like bus drivers, restaurant staff and security people amongst others.

I presume I am allowed count myself in that category am I? seen as I work later than all these occupations you have mentioned.
A, They all work shifts so its entirely possible for these people to go out another night when they are not working until midnight. Or do you think we should drink ourselves stupid 7 days a week?
B, Finishing at 12 still allows you to go have a drink and unwind, ok you cant stay that long but I do not believe that the majority of people finishing a shift at midnight wish to get hammered drunk and wrestle their way into a taxi only to have to go back into work for 8 or 9am. I know the security I talk to go straight home, in fact some of the staff cant wait to get in the car cause they have 2 jobs.

For the record, I agree that closing hours arent the problem. I merely point out the crap that people are throwing about. Folks, "Spirit" does not believe any anti-social behaviour happens outside their premises, are you joking? Im standing out there watching and dealing with it. Granted its not the worst but to make the place out to be filled with angels is stupidity. Anyone that has stepped foot in the place knows whats inside but Im not going to spell it out.
Staggered opening and closing hours is a good idea but there would have to be a limit, ie when the first bar closes the others stop letting people in, that way blind drunk fools cant just wander from bar to bar.