Neutrality at Shannon still being abused

by Doubtful Thu Jun 19, 2008 10:45

I'm not sure there is a need for a referendum regarding the long-standing and ongoing "military" situation at Shannon Airport?

Allowing for Article 29 of Bunreacht na hEireann (the Constitution of the Republic of Ireland, which literally translated actually means the "basic law" of the Republic of Ireland), it might be FAR, FAR more appropriate for our electorate to ask our "elected representatives", and MUCH more so our UNELECTED judiciary, why they now appear to all have abandoned our hard-won Constitution? -- which, over a period of some 8 centuries or so (say 32 generations or thereabouts), was "paid for" by our forbears in terms that could realistically be described as "rivers and lakes of blood", and "mountains of abuse, misery and suffering".

Now, many of "them" still can't wait to give it (our Constitution) all away? - even after the almighty "slap in the mouth" they have been given by the electorate regarding the Lisbon Treaty - which, compared to Bunreacht na hEireann, and by ANY healthy standards, is just an incomprehensible pile of verbal rubbish, which is very deliberately and very cleverly designed to slyly enable despots and plutocrats of all kinds to do whatever they wish, particularly in regard to human rights law (as set out by the United Nations).

Who in their right minds (apart from the "wolves in sheep's clothing" corrupt beneficiaries) would want to swop the Lisbon Treaty for Bunreacht na hEireann?

Among several other things, and for those who may not already know, Article 29 of Bunreacht na hEireann contains the following statements:

1) "Ireland affirms its devotion to the ideal of peace and friendly co-operation amongst nations founded on international justice and morality."

2) "Ireland affirms its adherence to the principle of the pacific settlement of international disputes by international arbitration or judicial determination."

3) "Ireland accepts the generally recognised principles of international law as its rule of conduct in its relations with other States."

So where are the eyes of our government -- Executive, Legislative, and Judicial -- regarding these extremely important Constitutional issues?

Why are "they" not upholding our Constitution? -- that (in my view) is the most pressing question that we (i.e. the electorate) need to get truthful and meaningful answers to from our so called "public servants" at the present time, and we need them "sooner rather than later".

Related link: http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=Bunreacht+na+hEire...earch

by indyjourno Thu Jun 19, 2008 10:36

Contrarian,

You are about as witty as you are as capable of maintaing honesty in your argument, spare indymedia your poor attempts at both.

Not once in your posts did you say "that they are not obliged to do so". The Gardaí are refusing to act in this case because of political reasons and not because of any issue to do with evidence. Any claims otherwise are a deliberate distortion.

You clearly are attempting to do nothing but spread bullshit. Something the Oirish (oh aren't you so witty, copying numerous publications, you must be a rip roaring solid Irish patriot) Daily Mail are very good at.

by Contrarian Wed Jun 18, 2008 22:39

Dear indyjourno,

If you are indeed a journalist, then I'm sure you have learned the importance of accuracy. I did NOT say that the Gardai are not permitted to investigate unsubstantiated allegations. Of course they are permitted to do so - any fool knows that. What I actually said was that they are not obliged to do so. In particular, there is no obligation to search any person, location or vehicle merely on the unsubstantiated allegation that it is "quite possible" that some crime was committed by that person/at that location/in that vehicle.

On the more positive side, your undoubted ability to distort my words and set up a straw man for your clever demolition bodes well for your future employment in the grubbier sections of the mainstream media. I hear the Oirish Daily Mail are hiring.

by Shannon CIA watch Wed Jun 18, 2008 16:28

Senator David Norris: That is profoundly undemocratic, as is the response of some of the leaders of Europe, who should be thoroughly ashamed of themselves. If there is egg on faces, the massive quantity of it should land on the people in Brussels who attempted to bully and hector, and who said we would be punished economically and would be the first victims financially. There were even people saying we should give back what we got. We got nothing to which we were not fully and legally entitled; of that there is no question. We also gave a hell of a lot. We gave our best expertise and the brains that helped to drive the Community. At the top of the Community, one will find Irish people giving loyal service. The Irish people are loyal to Europe but when they are treated like fools, when they are treated with contempt, when they are treated with a lack of respect for democracy-----
An Leas-Chathaoirleach: Those are points that can be made in the debate.
Senator David Norris: I am sick of asking questions in this House. I asked a series of very detailed questions about the military aspects of the treaty - that was why I voted against it - including the European Defence Agency, coyly renamed from the Western European Armaments Group, and the redefinition of the Petersberg tasks to include intervention in a third country because of a threat of terrorism, which is what got the United States into Iraq. That is why I am worried.

I am moving an amendment to the Order of Business today because of my concerns. I want No. 27, motion 15, concerning rendition, to be taken today.

It shows how we are already compromised by this Government. As we speak, aeroplane No. N54PA is on the tarmac at Shannon Airport.

Commandant Ed Horgan, who was on the platform with me as the voice of
the people against Lisbon for this military reason, is detained at Shannon
Airport. He is not allowed to leave the airport. He has requested the Garda to
search that aeroplane which was in Guantanamo on 3 June this year. Attempts
are being made to remove the camera which he legally possesses and destroy the film. For that reason, and because I got no answers to any of these questions about the increasing militarisation of Europe, I am moving an amendment to the Order of Business. I second Senator Bacik's amendment to the Order of Business.

by EINN Wed Jun 18, 2008 16:18

Some more details about the Phoenix Air Learjet 35/36 which has been through Shannon three times so far this month (June 2008).

As it happens, the same aircraft was at Guantanamo Bay at the start of June. It flew from its base at Cartersville, Georgia to Guantanamo on 3rd June, and from there to Norfolk Naval Station (Chambers Fld) in the US.

It subsequently passed through Shannon on these dates:

- 13th June (heading east from its base in the US, via Halifax in Canada); and

- 14th June (heading west, again to Halifax for refuelling, and on to Fort Lauderdale in Florida).

It arrived back in Shannon early this morning (18th June) from its Cartersville base, via Gander in Canada. The tracking website (details below) does not cover much outside the US, so I don't know where it headed after Shannon on its journey eastbound. But all this information would be with Eurocontrol, with whom a flight plan is filed. On the basis of its usual pattern, we can expect to see it back in Shannon before too long, heading back to the US.

It did *not* travel directly between Shannon and Guantanamo (even with the necessary refuelling stops) in any flight records I have been able to find, in case anyone is inclined to overstate a direct link. I have made extensive searches, but its flights through Shannon and those to Guantanamo Bay do not seem to be related in any way. It frequently visited military airfields in the US. This does not mean, of course, that it did not transfer a prisoner to another aircraft. But this is a theoretical possiblity, rather than something for which there is any evidence.

For noticifation in advance about flights by certain aircraft such as N54PA and N71PG, see www.flightaware.com. You can set up an email alert which will notify you of their movements. Alternatively, an alert can be set up for all movements through Shannon: the code for Shannon is EINN. The link for the most recent flight of this aircraft is below.

Please be aware that some of the aircraft used for renditions have also been available for charter. So when you see details of a "suspect" aircraft, it could be doing regular commercial work, or it could be chartered by the CIA or its affiliates. It's very important not to overstate the case, or present speculation as fact. This simply undermines the important work being done to expose what is going on.

by indyjourno Wed Jun 18, 2008 15:04

Contrarian you are talking utter garbage. According to you Gardaí only act when evidence of a crime has been presented to them. This is blatantly false and exposes a piss poor grasping of what the Gardaí do.

Gardaí do act to prevent crime solely based on unsubstantiated allegations and they also act to deal with crime taking place in the present based solely on unsubstantiated allegations. Its what the Garda hotline has been setup for, to facilitate the investigation of crime from anonymous and unsubstantiated sources.

The allegations of what the CIA get up to are made by people who are not anonymous and the allegations have enough evidence to merit investigation. The allegations have come from a wide range of sourcesacross the world.

You based your arguments on either a deep misunderstanding of what the Gardaí do (or are willing to do) or a deliberate act of spreading bullshit

by Contrarian Tue Jun 17, 2008 23:42

Good. Then present that hard evidence to the Gardai and let them investigate it. That's their job. And they are of course required to act when evidence of a crime is presented to them. Unlike, say, when unsubstantiated allegations are presented that somebody "might possibly" have committed a crime (details unknown) against a person (identity unknown) on a date unknown.

by Edward Horgan Tue Jun 17, 2008 14:48

Contrarian "Do you have one shred of hard evidence that ANY prisoner was EVER transported for torture through Shannon? Even once?"
Answer: YES

by Contrarian Mon Jun 16, 2008 22:00

"It is quite possible that this CIA aircraft had a prisoner or prisoners on board when it was refuelled at Shannon today."

Presumably, Ed, it was "quite possible" that you might have been in possession of all sorts of incriminating stuff while visiting Shannon. Yet, I'm sure you might have been a bit peeved if you had been arrested and searched on the basis of what some Garda thought it was "quite possible" that you may have been up to.

I'm afraid, lads, the bar will have to be lifted a bit higher than "quite possible" to justify a Garda search. Think reasonable suspicion based on EVIDENCE not on fanciful supposition. Do you have one shred of hard evidence that ANY prisoner was EVER transported for torture through Shannon? Even once?

by easterman Mon Jun 16, 2008 20:03

Thanks for that Ed . Good luck with the application ; I don't see how dereliction of duty on this scale can be ignored by the ombudsman . Surely they're not allowed to turn a blind eye to kidnapping ; still less collude with it.

by Edward Horgan Sun Jun 15, 2008 18:55

Hello Easterman,
The hierarchy in the decision making process that results in Garda refusal to search CIA and US military and chartered planes at Shannon begins at the top and ends at the bottom. In outer words, decisions have been made by former Taoiseach Mr Bertie Ahern TD, and by default or in fact, by An Taoiseach Mr Brian Cowen TD, supported to successive ministers for Justice, Foreign affairs, Transport, and Defence. The ministers include, Brian Cowen, Dermott Ahern and now Michael Martin, as Foreign Affairs, Seamus Brennan, Martin Cullen, and Noel Dempsey as transport, Willie O'Dea as Defence, Michael McDowell, Brian Lenihan, and now Dermott Ahern as Justice. In addition all members of the Gardai, from the Commissioners, down through Chief Superintended and Superintendent at Ennis Co Clare, Inspector Kennedy at Shannon, each Garda Sergeant in charge of each Garda shift each day at Shannon airport, and each individual Garda on duty at or near Shannon airport at any time from at least October 2001 up to the present time have had a direct responsibility and duty to search CIA and other US military related planes at Shannon once it became known that the US was transporting prisoners to Guantamamo prison and other locations where they might have been tortured.
As with soldiers in the Defence Forces, each member of the Gardai on duty has an obligation to investigate all serious crimes that he knows or suspects may be committed, or facilitated or in which facilities or persons in his jurisdiction may be complicit. Torture is recognised internationally as the most henious of crimes, worse even than most murders. A Garda on duty also has a legal and a moral duty not to obey or to disobey all unlawful orders. The defence of doing wrong or failing to do what is right because of superior orders has not been legitimate since the Nuremberg trials, and arguably even before that.

With regard to taking a complaint to the Garda Ombudsman, I have already made formal and detailed complaints to the Garda Commissioner, the Minister for Justice, and Chief Inspector of an Garda Siochana, Ms Kathleen O'Toole. It is our intention to make a complaint also to the Garda Ombudsman, but with only 24 hours in the each day and absolutely no funding to undertake these legal matters, we do have some limitations on what we can do. We plan to institute the complaint to the GArda Ombudsman in the next few weeks

by easterman Sun Jun 15, 2008 14:24

Sometimes it may seem you are ploughing a lonely furrow . But for the sake of justice and humanity please carry on doing what you do . Knowledge is power. Excuse my ignorance but have you taken a case to the Gardai Ombudsman re. the refusal of the Guards to investigate possible kidnappings . If there was a hint of drugs being on a plane in shannon the Guards would be all over it like a rash . Who exactly in their hierarchy is making the decision not to uphold the law of the state ?

by Mark C Sun Jun 15, 2008 11:07

Apparently N54PA has arrived in Cartersville, Gerogia.

Mark.

by Edward Horgan Sat Jun 14, 2008 22:07

CIA Learjet N54PA was again refuelled at Shannon today, on its return journey to the United States. It left Shannon at about 1240pm local time and flew on the Halifax airport in Newfoundland, Canada. It is now flying between Newfoundland and Fort Lauderdale in Florida which is the normal last stopping point before Guantanamo.
It is quite possible that this CIA aircraft had a prisoner or prisoners on board when it was refuelled at Shannon today.
We do not yet know where it went to after it left Shannon at about 10am on Friday 13 June. There was sufficient time to have flown to Iraq or Afghanistan, to collect prisoners.
We did not become aware of its presence at Shannon on Saturday (today) until after it had already left for Canada.

We urgently need more monitors at Shannon airport. We need a small semi permanent peace camp to provide a base for monitoring the CIA and US military movements through the airport. We need you now to prevent the continuing use of Shannon airport for complicity in crimes against humanity. Persons willing to do time at Shannon should contact Edward Horgan or Conor Cregan ASAP.

If there were prisoners on board N54PA at Shannon airport today, I deeply regret being unable to help you, whoever you are.
Edward

by Fred Johnston Sat Jun 14, 2008 18:23

More than once I have seen the Omni Air 'plane at Shannon. At Glasgow/Prestwick at the end of last week, a large Canadian-marked (it certainly appeared to be) transport sat on the tarmac.
At any rate, the Learjet referred to above, tail N54PA, visited Guantanamo, apparently, on March 18th 2007, and has been to Ft Lauderdale and Cartersville, USA or through these fields, more than once. On June 14th this year it flew from Shannon to Halifax at roughly 40,000 ft: (34256 - 8/18/07 - 3:04 AM - N54PA LJ36 3 MUGM GUANTANAMO BAY NS KNIP JACKSONVILLE NAS ) PA on the number stands for Phoenix Air. It was also spotted at London/Luton on December 12th 2004. According to 'Mark Turner.Net, ' "According to N.C. Stop Torture Now, a Learjet with tail number N54PA flew from Cartersville, GA () to RDU on the morning September 17th. Flight logs shows this particular jet has visited Guantanamo Bay on a regular basis." It was, oddly, in Seoul, South Korea, on February 3rd this year. It gets around. Clearly not the sort of aircraft our secuirty forces would want to inspect - even though any of the above information on the 'plane can be found on the Web. It is clearly a suspicious aircraft.

by Mary Kelly Sat Jun 14, 2008 12:06

Conor and Ed. Stay on the FBO and Gardai's case for NOT taking action. Yesterday's decison in US Supreme Court http://www.ucc.ie/law/blogs/ccjhr/ re Guantanamo prisoners will certainly bring change that will be uncomfortably felt by FBO and Gardai at Shannon.

The Irish government may well find itself held accountable in several courts sparked by a case currently being litigated by ACLU against Boeing subsidiary Jeppesen Dataplan Incorporated, on behalf of victims of the United States Government’s unlawful 'extraortdinary rendition 'program. The victims alleged that Jeppesen, through its knowing participation in the rendition programme by providing flight services was either directly or indirectly liable for the forced disappearance, torture and other forms of cruel, inhuman, or degrading treatment to which the plaintiffs were subjected. A certain number of these flights passed through Ireland on their way to and from the United States. Ireland and the Shannon stopovers get particular mention in the complaints made by the alleged victims of the rendition flights. It was also alleged that Jeppesen contacted Ireland in relation to instructions for ground handling agents, re-fuelling, aircraft maintenance, customs clearance, service and and crew security. This case specifically implicates the actions of the Irish Government at Shannon, FBO and Shannon Gardai for assisting in extraordinary rendition to places of detention where the victims were systematically tortured.

Since 2002 I have made Gardai FBO and army personnel aware of this possibility; however they continued to follow orders blind. I now look forward to seeing them punished for this despicable breach of Irish and international law, plus their disgusting treatment of all the people who have struggled to keep it a live exposed issue.

by Edward Horgan Fri Jun 13, 2008 23:48

Conor Cregan collecting evidence of complicity in torture and War Crimes at Shannon airport on 13 June 2008.

Shinning a light into a black hole at Shannon 0.82 Mb