Armed Gardai and the Lusk Situation

by Frank Miller Mon Oct 29, 2007 11:50

At Lusk post office, two members of an armed gang resisted arrest and the ERU officers believed their lives were in danger. Tragic for the families of the two dead men but fortunately postal staff, innocent bystanders and gardai were not killed instead.

At Abbeylara, a deranged man opened fire on gardai and continued to fire at anybody who tried to talk him out of his house. He then emerged from the house with a loaded weapon and refused to surrender. Gardai shot him because they feared he was going to fire on them. Thankfully nobody else was killed.

In both cases the actions of the armed gardai was justified and had there no been an armed response there could well have been innocent people killed.

I am not sold on the need for a fully armed police force in Ireland. But I believe there is a need for an armed response to lethal scenarios that cannot be dealt with by unarmed officers.

by Forensic Mon Oct 29, 2007 13:58

The work of the Independent coroners court was halted from the second to the third of October 2007,
after forensic evidence stated that the only weapons dispensed were those of the ERU. The Coroner
stated that he would continue to follow the issue and that a verdict would be brought in for the
survivors. Since that date there has been a complete media blackout on the Coroner's Court. The not
Inconsiderable political arm of the GRA had complained at the independent investigation.

Arming the Garda without a properly backed up Commission independent of the Ombudsman
and the GRA indicates a political lobby. There are two armed branches of the Gardai at the moment:
Special Branch and ERU. They are fighting for SWAT. Yesterday they used the National Airwaves to
launch a campaign to have their members armed and that is offensive.
It is offensive enought to be confronted with Gardai in bullet proof whilst bringing kids to school.

There is no credible and accountable head of an independent body who can monitor the issue of
Garda abuse and or corruption:-
Millions of Euro has been spent on tribunals in Donegal (cf The Silver Bullet Report/The Morris
Tribunal and Abbeylara) to a force solely accountable to the Current and previous Ministers for
Justice. If the Gardai plod are to be armed then the civilian population have rights:

1.The right to know where the money is going.
2.The right to redress in the case of personal injury.
3.The right to answers regarding coroner's court and civil courts.
4.The right to full legal aid in the case of defense against brutality.
5.The right not to be obfuscated in their search for answers by a Representative body
with legal and political power.
6.The right to full disclosure by the representative body of armed forces be they miltiary
or Garda.
7.The right to analyse budgetary considerations in relation to Garda activity,
(millions went on the one year Garda campaign in Rossport, whilst drug gangs
are given free reign in the city).

The Coroner's Court refused to halt the inquest into the shootings of two men against intense
pressure by the GRA to call a halt on the issue. ERU had screens whilst family survivors
sat in open court.

by FF Hack Mon Oct 29, 2007 18:38

Not only are the special branch and the ERU armed but also all detectives and many plain clothes Gardai carry arms including those seconded to escort the banks armoured vans. To make it simple only Gardai who wear the ordinary blue uniform are unarmed.

All the rest are obliged to carry guns. A few years ago my house was being watched 24/7 by ordinary gardai in plain clothes. It was only after a few days that I realised that these boyos were armed. I made a fuss about this and took some photographs. After that it was only detectives who parked outsde my house.

Its not a big step in the GS being an armed force. Its nearly there already.

by - Mon Oct 29, 2007 18:58

http://www.gra.ie

The title is:- 'Garda Shooting Demands a New Response'

Particular attention to be paid to paragraph six- which details the need for an armed response
in a modern society to the shooting of police Officers. The release made it onto two National
Radio stations yesterday morning. In order for even the tiniest consideration to be given to
Garda safety a separate commitment has to be made to the issue of civil safety and redress.
There should be no need for tribunals if the infrastructure is in place , so that people may feel
they can elicit answers from an independent and accountable body which allows for
legal aid and inquests to be conducted independently of political interferences.

PJ Stone

by Seamus Tue Oct 30, 2007 10:54 twtone at lycos dot com

The GRA is akin to the nazi era Gestapo. Both represent facist thugs with no respect for civil and human rights. Its typical of P.J.Stone-Mad to be calling for arming all Gardai, its not the first time nor the last no doubt.
If this happens then we are a complete police state as wet dreamed of by Stone-Mad and those he represents....
S