John Gormley Leadership Deception

by John Boy Fri Jun 29, 2007 08:25

The Greens were always going to be bettter off out of government...they could be seen to be righteous and so on without actually having any impact. It's better that way because you never have to make any compromises and you can still be seen to impervious to questions on ethics and morals.

It's far more useful than getting your foot in the door to get yourself in position to actually make a difference.

by Jim O'Sullivan Fri Jun 29, 2007 08:57

"It's far more useful than getting your foot in the door to get yourself in position to actually make a difference.'

Care John Boy to give us an example of what they will change? Have you read the Programme for Government that the Greens rolled over, agreed to and are now stuck with? The truth is that the Greens are now assisting with the implementaion of the FF/PD agenda which has at it's core, privatisation. Creating a killing field for the "golden circle" to exploit.

by O the humanity Fri Jun 29, 2007 10:11

Afterall he is ex of Fianna Fail and they do know how to play the
game- oh very shadowy! I expect he will be after the whip next
or is that Dan's little job?

[imagine having your many years of work disgraced on an open
newswire- the inhumanity of it, now why did he leave FF?]

by maire Fri Jun 29, 2007 14:10

If we are in a democracy, can we accept that the majority of the paid up Green party voted to go into government . Let's give them a chance to make a difference, and get experience of being in government.
Remember that was the excuse being used against them to not give them your vote.

If your agenda is so different from the Greens, join another party and pay up.

by For the record Fri Jun 29, 2007 14:21

"the majority of the paid up Green party voted to go into government"

No it was not the majority or paid up members but the majority of members who were able and did attend the vote for this motion.

by John Boy Fri Jun 29, 2007 14:38

It's easier to push for something from the inside. You nod your head to get to where you want and then with ministerial power, you have a better chance of making a difference. There's no way they could have made it into government by insisting on every one of their own policies being implemented. You have to play the game.

What could they have implemented from the outside?

Ooh ooh, I know. Absolutely nothing.

by John Boy Fri Jun 29, 2007 14:39

It's easier to push for something from the inside. You nod your head to get to where you want and then with ministerial power, you have a better chance of making a difference. There's no way they could have made it into government by insisting on every one of their own policies being implemented. You have to play the game.

What could they have implemented from the outside?

Ooh ooh, I know. Absolutely nothing.

by Jim O'Sullivan Fri Jun 29, 2007 17:52

Dear John
You say,
"It's easier to push for something from the inside. You nod your head to get to where you want and then with ministerial power, you have a better chance of making a difference. There's no way they could have made it into government by insisting on every one of their own policies being implemented. You have to play the game.
What could they have implemented from the outside?
oh ooh, I know. Absolutely nothing."

This view is a direct attack on democracy itself. It suggests that Political Parties can go to the electorate with a manifesto and post election, tear up that manifesto and assume a completely different position on key issues, but still use the votes received on the original manifesto to get into government which requires support for the implementaton of policies that are at complete variance with the manifesto on which the electorate gave their support to. The fact is that the vast majority of people who voted for the Greens have been duped because the Greens are now supporting the implementaion of major policies that there is wide spread concern about. Remember, that despite the Celtic Tiger, the outgoing government could not get the majority to continue in power and indeed the PD's were decimated. The co-location plan is a PD ruse to grow the for-profit sector in the Health Service and I have no doubt that the people emphatically rejected that. By supporting the FF/PD agenda, the Greens have denied the people their democratic rights.

What can be achieved from outside? Take wednesadys vote on co-location. If the Greens had stayed out of government, support for this policy would have been wafer thin and for the government to proceed with it would have been much more difficult. With the Greens in tow, the figures give the policy a gloss it otherwise would have lacked and it is doubtful if a government comprising FF, PD and a few indys could have proceeded with the policy. They would have clearly lacked any moral authority to do so. And don't start me on Tara.

by Siobhan - TaraWatch Sat Jun 30, 2007 00:46

The greens have proved beyond doubt that they betrayed their voters. They pretend that they werent aware of the issues pertaining to tara yet Noel Dempsey catagorically stated otherwise on Questions and answers. John Gormley said thaT HIS DOOR WAS OPEN TO DISCUSS SUCH ISSUES however when we arrived to voice our concerns about Tara he refused to meet with us. Shame on them( the greens) .

by Jane Sat Jun 30, 2007 09:53

Maire wrote:
"If we are in a democracy, can we accept that the majority of the paid up Green party voted to go into government "

If we are in a democracy, can we accept that it is the general public votes that are supposed to matter, not party members. I voted Green, something I won't be doing again, because I thought they stood for something, US military out of Shannon, M3 out of Tara, Shell to Sea, and Fianna Fail OUT OF GOVERNMENT. An lot of people who voted for Greens did so because they believed Green rhetoric on those very topics.

Now, if the people who made it to the party convention sought to endorse the plan which did they opposite of the things that , well they're forgetting democracy, but perhaps they'll be harshly reminded in 5 years by people not so grateful for co-location of hospitals, use of Shannon to attack Iran, as well as continued occupation of Iraq and Afghanistan, destruction of Tara, and the implementation of more laws and treaties to make the EU a superstate, and privatise services.

And it's not true that nothing can be done in opposition. Even with the limp oppostion faced in the past FF has been forced to steal clothes from the Greens, and the Socialist to try to pre-empt any growth in those parties support. Well, now the Greens cannot do that, and Joe Higgins, alas is not in the Dail to ask the hard questions, leaving only those muppets Kenny and Rabbitte.

by greendublin2007 - Former Green Sun Jul 01, 2007 00:19 greendublin2007 at gmail dot com

Gormley to announce candidacy on RTE
John Gormley will announce he has the required 50 nominations for leadership bid.
John Gormley will confirm his intention to run for the Green Party leadership in an RTE radio interview at lunch time today (Sun 01/07/07). (This Week - RTE Radio 1 at 1pm)
He will confirm he has the required 50 nominations for the post. This is down to some serious underground campaigning on his behalf since hours after Trevor Sargent's resignation.

by greendublin2007 - Former Green Sun Jul 01, 2007 00:54 greendublin2007 at gmail dot com

Former MEP reaches required quota
Patricia McKenna has secured the 50 nominations required to run for the Green Party leadership.
Patricia McKenna, the former Green MEP, anti-war campaigner, and outspoken critic of the Green Party's deal to prop up the FF/PD government, has secured the necessary 50 nominations to run for the Green Party leadership.
Ms. McKenna, who has supported the campaign against the Shannon stopover fights and the Tara/M3 campaign, has recently been vociferous in her condemnation of what she perceived as a sell out of core Green values following the electoral pact with FF and the PD's. She has stated her case in recent interviews with NewsTalk, RTE Radio 1 and most significantly the current issue of Hot Press magazine.
This could prove to be seriously embarrassing to John Gormley, Eamon Ryan, Dan Boyle and others who were strong supporters of the electoral pact, as any votes for Ms. McKenna will be seen as votes against their stance.
This may be the beginning of one of the most significant months in Irish Green politics.

by Attonment Sun Jul 01, 2007 23:15

Atonement and reparations for the innocent dead in Iraq and Afghanistan, will be a long time comming. The Green Party in Government is already complicit in the killing of hundreds of civilians in Iraq and Afghanistan.
Even though a majority of the Green party members and supporters are female, the party has become increasingly male dominated, like all the other parties in the Dail. Now that the Greens have at lease one female RD, it is difficult to explain how Trevor Sergeant grabbed the job as minister of state, in spite of his pre-election protestations, when equality, logic and dedication to core Green principles, should have seen that position go to Mary White. Patricia McKenna is the only one of the senior Green Party members with credibility, and with her principles intact, to lead the Green Party. A very substantial number of Green Party members are appalled by the Green Party u-turn on joining the FF government, and the abandonment of most of the fundamental Green Party principles. There is a serious risk that many of these principled members may leave the Green Party, as Rump of the Greens become FF fellow travellers.
Over the past year, we have seen the Green party TDs abandon Green party radical policies and rush into the over-crowded political centre. They have been successfully lured by the siren of power on to the rocks of compromise.
We need Patricia McKenna to restore some credibility to the Green Party, if it is not to follow in the footsteps of the PDs, Clan na Talun, and other now extinct species. The Greens are the corncrakes of today’s Irish politics. The corncrakes are confined to the swamps of the Shannon callows, while the Greens have abandoned Shannon to the US military.
It was gossip at the Green Party convention that voted for entering government, that many who were opposed to that decision simply stayed away from the convention so as not to split the Green Party. If that were so it was a serious mistake. Now is the time to come forward and put a credible leader in charge of the party.
That credible leader is Patricia McKenna.

by Pat - none Mon Jul 02, 2007 23:00 none none

What a tranformation,

From a beautiful colour to a downbeat grey,

Now that the metamorphosis has taken place perhaps it is time for a new name,

How about the GREED PARTY.

by C. Thu Jul 19, 2007 13:40

Given john Gormley's history in supporting eco campaign, I am rather surprised that he
has not commented on the 7 arrests in Tara. The bail conditions of the three released
nor the continued incarceration of four men who include a 70 year old (until wednesday of
next week). The Court hearings are Wednesday morning, Navan Court.
That gives Gormley a few days to make statment on why members of the public engaged
in peaceful protest have been set upon by contractors and arrested for the pleasure
of it. He has the relevant information.