Russian Spy Assassinated with Commn Cigarette Contaminant

by Puff Puff Tue Nov 28, 2006 18:40

If this chemical is in cigarettes then it is in tiny quantities. Perhaps you havent noticed but smokers do not lose their hair within a few hours of smoking a cigarrette. Nor do they die within two days. There are many things which are bad for your health: alcohol and peanuts. Peanuts? Yes, some have a fatal allergy to peanuts and indeed all nuts. Should they be banned?

Get a sense of perspective.

by chrissie Tue Nov 28, 2006 21:14

Whatever is your drug of choice, it makes you think its way! I try not to persecute smokers, & that shld be a mutual thing, but it's undeniably bad for yr health, especially those extra-stinky 'tailor-made' fags.

by iosaf Tue Nov 28, 2006 23:39

I find that report delightful in a very sick way.., ¿does this mean the tobacco industry might have been involved in this murder, since they would have easy access to "polonium what you call it"? Hmmmmm.
it's wasn't Blair, nor Putin, nor Borat or even Rusky mafia - it was marlboro man.

by :-) - iosaf Tue Nov 28, 2006 23:55

is located just upstairs from offices which have been cordoned off in the on-going investigation into the poisoning of the Mr ex-KGB. The Director of Metro London inquired as to the risk of radiation poisoning on behalf of his staff - & for the moment the alarm hasn't been raised. However, the toxicology & radiation treatment divisions of the London hospitals are being kept very busy, lots of Londoners worrying that little bit more about how dangerous their traditional ale & sushi or glowstick might actually be.

Personally I think it's all pants..,
Worse than pants. Just a grade up from his excellency's thong. Because the infamous ( at least it ought be infamous ) COBRA commitee apparantly met to report death & the direction of the subsequent investigation / whitewash. You remember COBRA ( I hope ). They are the unelected group who co-ordinate British state security interests giving the current heads of MI5, SIS & the likes an ocassion to sit down & get big time sinister. They delete British news, they withhold information, & they do this through a whole raft of measures (some dating back to the Fenian threat of the 19th century must based on the last Irish conflict ) which make the "patriot act" look like a ......................... satirical movie on the presidency of Kazakhstan.

Because quite simply the COBRA commitee (which decided the death of De Menezes, 22/7/05 & also oversaw the disinformation campaign thereafter [ winter coat - 5 bullets - 8 bullets - finally 9 bullets & half of them dum dum ] are the sort of people Yankee political representatives get to question once in a while.

No brit can do that. They ( & The Irish ) just get movie propaganda.

incidently if you're worrying about radiation poisoning - the hair falling out is a real give away yes - but 4 people I knew during my stay in London believed they had been so "got at" & all of them combined hair loss with loss of molar teeth & bleeding gums. Of those 4, one was later to die in a car crash. Oddly enough. & all they did was talk about the arms trade.

His excellency Mister Borat has been exhonorated.

by Hiram - NWO Wed Nov 29, 2006 15:26 Moonbase

UFO Nut Sells Spy Poison Online

"The radioactive material that killed a former Russian spy in Britain can be bought on the Internet for $69," Information Week is reporting.

FF_192_chem1_f.jpgPolonium-210, which experts say is many times more deadly than cyanide, can be bought legally through United Nuclear Scientific Supplies, a mail-order company that sells through the Web, based in Sandia Park, N.M. Chemcial companies sell the Polonium-210 legally for industrial use, such as removing static electricity from machinery. United Nuclear claims that it's "currently the only legal Alpha source available without a license."

by marlboro man ;-) Wed Nov 29, 2006 17:50

The London offices of Metro international being "just upstairs" from one of 8 areas of that city now found to be radioactive are taking quite an interest in the story. (c/F comments above) Accordingly they published a short interview in today's European editions with an ex-boss of the KGB in Europe, who also "retired" to live in sunny friendly Engurland. & when asked "who's next?" He replied it's the "Russian magnate" whose offices are "just downstairs" from Metro & who quite famously in those circles accepts neither food nor drink for other Russians ( or post-Soviet citizens of any type or nature).

"jolly sensible".

This makes me giggle. Neither Barcelona (where I live) or Ireland (where ye mostly live) have magnates. We just have capitalists, corrupt feckers, businessmen, a few millionaires & politicians. Years ago to be a "magnate" you had to be :-
* Greek.
* wear sunglasses.
* own lots of ships.
* have some sort of "in-law" relationship to the US government.

Now all you need to be is a the type of guy (there are no female magnates yet) who holds Borat's strings.

Oh yeah!
You also have to be on the other side of the post Soviet neo-liberal capitalist re-organisation scheme of things than the Andropov / Putin axis......................... or so many people are willing to believe.

by Spinning Quickly Wed Nov 29, 2006 18:27

I'll put my cards on the table and say that I support the smoking ban and find tobacco smoke difficult to put up with. I also regard the tobacco industry as one of the most corrupt. That said, I'll make a few points:

*As Puff Puff pointed out, smokers tend to last longer than the 23 days between Alexander Litvinenko falling ill and his death. Look at the link I give to Wikipedia on health risks of tobacco smoking - there is a strong correlation between smoking and lung cancer - but the rise is a 20-year time lag, not a 23-day one! This clearly shows that
*Polonium has no function in the body but is formed from inhaling radon gas if the radon decays to polonium while in the lungs. (Another possible source of the stuff!)
*Polonium is incredibly toxic - the maximum safe body burden is 7 picogrammes - that's seven *millionth*of*a*millionth* of a gramme.
*It is a potent source of alpha partices, which can do immense damage if ingested.
[See _Natures' Building Blocks_ by John Emsley]

Now for smoking itself:
*The main source of cancer is from the polcyclic aromatic hydrocarbons, particularly benzopyrene which has a well-understood process of causing cancer *chemically*, rather than through radiation.

Now I notice that the original poster had the subheading "Pub Owners Ought not be responsible for health harms they did not cause" which suggests they are trying to shift the blame for passive smoking, possibly with a view to get the law banning smoking in pubs revoked.

by glow in the dark - (iosaf) Thu Nov 30, 2006 11:30

Well that's that then.
conclusive proof.
The dead man was a Russian.
He ate Japanese friends & published in English & lived in London but only Russians would want to kill him with a metal named after Poland they put in cigarettes.

& now British Airways flights to Moscow ( a Russian city ) are contaminated.

I suppose it's too late to excite interest in who really killed Cock Robin ( you remember Mr Donaldson don't ye? back before Mc Dowell was tainaiste.)

Marie & Pierre Curie (A Polish & French couple) who discovered Russian poisons they put on aircraft & in cigarettes. She got a Nobel prize for that.

by iosaf glows in the dark Thu Nov 30, 2006 11:31

Well that's that then.
conclusive proof.
The dead man was a Russian.
He ate Japanese friends & published in English & lived in London but only Russians would want to kill him with a metal named after Poland they put in cigarettes.

& now British Airways flights to Moscow ( a Russian city ) are contaminated.

I suppose it's too late to excite interest in who really killed Cock Robin ( you remember Mr Donaldson don't ye? back before Mc Dowell was tainaiste.)

Marie & Pierre Curie (A Polish & French couple) who discovered Russian poisons they put on aircraft & in cigarettes. She got a Nobel prize for that.

by Recipes. Thu Nov 30, 2006 11:47

The 'style' was different to the typical execution- tho' it does not explain
why he was shot in the right hand -unless he was 'winged'.

(carrying an arm- standard siege stuff, check out Abbeylara)

nor does it explain this_ why a Minister for Justice said that he was 'shot in the head'- before the PM.

by iosaf Thu Nov 30, 2006 19:36

Such as why in the official version of that day, it was Peter Hain who informed Gerry Adams who then told Donaldson's next of kin. Despite Donegal being outside of Hain's jurisdiction as a British minister & quite far away from Gerry Adam's constituency bearing in mind that Donaldson had by stage been expelled from the Sinn Fein party of which Adams is, was & forever shall be president.

Whereas -

Michael Mc Dowell as minister of Justice of Eire did not offer garda protection to cock robin or open a proper investigation or even appear to perturbed that his "patch" as it was had been touched, bearing in mind that he had many times before exceded his jurisdiction by commenting publically on judicial cases & investigations in the Northern Ireland statelet. In fact I seem to recall Mc Dowell went on holidays, something he does when the shite hits the fan. c/f how that news was broken :- http://indymedia.ie/article/75253 & for some "iosaf analysis" read "green bottles - Irish parlour games for Christmas & Hannukah 2005" & the comments thereof.

Anyway. ((( to properly update the thread)))

A disreputable Moscow businesman (but not a magnate) has been hospitalised with suspected polonium poisoning. & the 3 Boeing jets grounded by BA over in Engurland flew to several other capital cities apart from Moscow. One of which was Barcelona the others being Vienna (always good for spy types) Stockholm (spies who go out to the cold) & Athens. I'm grand of course, got all my hair, all my teeth, & I never accept food, sushi or drink from Russians, Magnates, Kazhaks or Bylerussians. I suppose there will now the usual rush on Geiger counters for Xmas prezzies.

by obit Thu Nov 30, 2006 21:05

Litvinenko was closely working with Politkovskya- she died in Moscow on October
the seventh. Mercenary assassination. Her death was not ascribed to Putin- who
suggested- given her 'handle with care' status, that she was more trouble dead
than alive.

Litvinenko claimed knowledge of who killed her- the night he got ill.

The man , now poisoned, is Gaider -ex Russian pm and critic of Putin.

The death of Litvinenko cast a glowing light on the works of the anti-secession Kosovo
contacts group- a Moscow org. charged with put-down of emergent democracies.

Litvinenko was murdered (or suicide ???) by someone on Mr Blair's 'british soil'

now Mr Blair wd not tolerate a black ops execution squad- it breaks rules
(we all know he likes the rules- ask Karen Gun {GCHQ}-

Mr Donaldson, was murdered on Irish Soil.
He was shot in the hand , {carrying a gun}= siege
He was shot in the chest-this killed him.

There were two shells outside the house.

Mr Mc Dowell claimed he was 'shot in the head'- execution style.

no-one claimed responsibility.

was it a black ops?
or was the state of this island responsible. we cannot trust the people who fucked
up international law {rendition/dirty wars/ gitmo./shannon}

it could of course be a doomed love affair.... the film-maker is gone into hiding.
he got the last interview.

by iosaf Thu Nov 30, 2006 22:36

As the who killed cock robin donald donaldson movie script reminds us, many a spy story doesn't get to the dizzy heights of Casino Royale.

But we can all exercise our memory & intellect & surprisingly developed " informed opinion on the Polonium 120 craze by remembering one of Indymedia Ireland's 5 year global network history's " great moments .

Coz regular contributors to indymedia ireland in many states of Europe helped to identify the "spy / security service airport web".

Now let's forget for a moment that no-one has yet gone into Shannon, Dublin or Knock airports with a geiger counter. Let's just remember their favourite European air destinations .

Coz put it this way, not even Madame Marie Curie would have managed to Micky Finn someone with Polonium 120 & get away Scot Free uncontiminated.

& now that we've remembered the Donaldson "await your executioner" moment of our recent history, pointed to established "soft airport destinations" for "license to kill" types.

I'll just leave you with the tantilising Turkish & Cyprus link.

Someone carrying the shite they put in cigarettes & killed mr ex-KGB agent ( & lovely guy all his life you know ) managed to take in several EU destinations. Most make perfect "plod & Watson" (backed up by Metro newspaper journalists & reading public) sense. Vienna, Dusseldorf, Barcelona & Stockholm all share very important characteristics which are not important enough to specify at the moment. But one "contaminated BA flight destination" is a surprise - Athens.

It reminds me of one other difficult death in the spooky circles of the last "7 years". That of Mr Saunders the MI6 station chief for eastern Europe & the Balkans. Of course he was blown up by November "what you call them & who were they really?" 17 who we remember from these articles & comments :-

http://www.indymedia.ie/article/62595
http://www.indymedia.ie/article/18147
http://www.indymedia.ie/newswire.php?story_id=41084

hmmmmmmmmmmmmmm.

If I were really & truly an utter gobshite I'd tell you all right now that it is very unlikely a Russian killed mr Borat Sushi.

But I'm not the "alien chem trail in the sky type". Nor are ye. We are not "aphasic". But we maintain this gobal network for a reason - we don't always accept the "official version".
If you're worried about the role played by Russian Magnates in drugs, prostitution, terrorism, the arms trade, eco-destruction, human trafficking, & illegal waste disposal..........................

Ask me to do a Sunday Papers on it.

This "story" is noteworthy in that it exposes a world of mirrors, smoke & lies that for the most part we only rumour about, we all now have an opportunity to wonder about "the Mafia v. State" relationship. I'll leave it for the moment with this old link (recruiting for MI6 http://www.indymedia.ie/article/72438 a human interest piece I put up the day after Ratzinger started recruiting a new generation of exorcists. hmmmmmmm yes his visit to Turkey & basically "all of him" does link into this as well. You could call it "post-Sovietism". Meanwhile Putin's dog's name is "Blacky". Oh yeah - the credit for the photo ( a back issue of my Sunday Papers series http://www.indymedia.ie/article/69829 curiously enough I always thought of writing a "Marie Curie" edition but never did. here is the link to the complete archive of my "Sunday Papers" articles )

http://www.indymedia.ie/newswire.php?search_text=sunday...apers

Blair, Putin & Putin's doggy. This was several weeks after the Russians accused MI6 of faking rocks & trees in Moscow putting cameras & eavesdropping gadgets in them. Don't they make a lovely pair?

by Yusuf Fri Dec 01, 2006 00:06

If you are interested in that sort of thing you may be interested in this sort of thing.....

http://www.directives.doe.gov/cgi-bin/explhcgi?qry10150...e-226

http://www.dtic.mil/whs/directives/corres/pdf/315008m_0...m.pdf

http://www.afrri.usuhs.mil/www/outreach/pdf/2edmmrchand...k.pdf

http://www.ncrppublications.org/index.cfm?fm=Product.Ad...21298

http://www.epa.gov/radiation/marssim/obtain.htm

by Harry Fri Dec 01, 2006 11:23

link:- http://www.guardian.co.uk/russia/0,,1961549,00.html

by iosaf Fri Dec 01, 2006 14:22

* Yes indeed folks, Mr Gaider's team say he got ill in Dublin after visiting a restaurant & was "close to death" .

* Interestingly Athens is the second hottest destination for the Polonium flights for investigators after Moscow.

* the Italians are outraged at Media attempts to link Mr Prodi (the nice) with the KGB (smells of Wilson doesn't it).

* One of my favourite things about the Russians is their love of chess, as dedicated readers of my stuff over the years will recall the game "chess" is very important to me (along with dogs) if you're into tactics & strategy & game play consider reading about the Irish "Master Morphy" who played 8 games simultanously whilst blindfolded & won 6 of them c/f http://indymedia.ie/article/74447#comment139484.

The Russian game often relies on bluff & false tactics to throw off the opposition. But one thing always signals the bluff - the sense of humour.

Let us remember the last really important "KGB related" poisoning case. That of Viktor Yushchenko in the Ukraine. You'll remember Viktor had lunch with the chiefs of the Ukranian secret services (who had been trained in the old KGB & have odd fluctuating good/bad relations to the current FSB [ you could remember Little Miss Julia Tymoshenko interpol warrent & its cancellation c/f http://indymedia.ie/article/68497 ] Now when Viktor got really ill after that meal he went to Switzerland & then London to see the toxicologists. There was quite a bit of speculation as to what had done that to him. Remember he went from matinee good lucks to Chernobyl swarthy ugly in a few weeks. Finally people learnt he had been got with "dioxines". Now observe the Russian chess style bluff . Later analysis proved that the dioxines had come from Agent Orange. Yushchenko of course led the Orange party. & quite splendidly he had been given enough agent Orange to not kill him - but get everyone curious & blame Putin.

So I'll leave ye all with a Question. Why Polonium? What is this "polish" / "madame Curie" reference? What's the bluff & joke?
Because quite honestly the KGB/FSB spook crew can mickey finn you with better gear.

a 5 kopek stamp to remember Maria Sklodowskaja Curie the Polish woman who named Polonium 120 after Poland 120th birthday. She got the Nobel prize you know.

by Correction Fri Dec 01, 2006 15:51

Maria Sklodowskaja Curie the Polish woman who named Polonium 120 after Poland 120th birthday

It is Polonium-210, not 120 (that would be Antimony, with medicinal and cosmetic properties)

by iosaf Fri Dec 01, 2006 20:41

If you're really interested in this shite, by now you ought to have read the Litvinenko file on wikipedia at least.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alexander_Litvinenko

In his death-bed statement provided by "Obit" in the article above Litvinenko made reference to an Italian "Mario", who was in fact Mario Scaramella. Mr Scaramella didn't eat sushi at the restaurant, but he has tested positive for Polonium 210 (thanks to last commentator for that correction).

He's not very popular in Italy. He's an academic who has a reputation as a "data provider". The sort of person who sells you information on others. But obviously not as charming nor powerful as the Merrovingian in the Matrix movie who we remember relied on the Cockney twins (Mi5/Mi6) to do his dirty work on pluck Neo & Trinity who really just wanted to have babies & live happily ever after in Zion................hmmmmmmmmm................... {no-one has brought Mossad into this yet.} Bearing out his un-popularity here is an article slamming his "fake CV" today in "Unita" the Italian leftwing daily http://www.unita.it/view.asp?IDcontent=61349

On his real CV (which is hard to find by the way) were such interesting titbits as advising the Soviets on one of their problematic submarines the K8. & he also got the job of stopping KGB/FSB infiltration in the Italian government
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mario_Scaramella http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Soviet_submarine_K-8

Please remember that the war time Pope excommunicated all the commies & socialists in Italy so Italy a predominantly leftwing working class by nature country would remain in the US/NATO axis.
hmmmm........ I'll make this reference simple- Have a look at this article & the comment immediately linked to http://www.indymedia.ie/article/68251?comment_order=asc...48767

Please remember in the last comment I made scant reference to the current "Wilsonish" accusations that Prodi (the man who helped end Berlusconi) is really a KGB/FSB stooge. Naturally Berlusconi would never have worked for the reds, post-reds, or forgotten about being red now in cahootes with the Mafia/Magnates. Oh no. He was more a Langley Virginia type...... or was he?............. remember Cassarini?
c/f

So for those of you who don't get the Wilson reference - Watch one of Ken Loach's movies "Hidden Agenda" which is set in Ireland oddly enough.

Apart from the mad alien type in the link above let's just wonder - if you wanted to buy radioactive material....... who would you go to?
Personally having been recently fined 300eu for carrying less than a gramme of hashish I wouldn't risk going to the Polish / Bylerussian border to score a microgram of Plutonium. I wouldn't even bother setting the deal up in some skuzzy Dublin restaurant.

cue Mossad..,

Mario is Italian. He met Mr Borat Sushi with the info. He didn't eat anything. He's contaminated with PL210

by Correction Sat Dec 02, 2006 14:48

I was involved in a (failed) attempt to interview a young man about 20 years ago who had swallowed a "harmless" radiation source in a college laboratory. I don't recall, but it was possibly Plutonium-239, a tiny speck in a metal holder kept in a foil-lined mahogany box. A single sheet of paper was sufficient to stop the alpha emissions, but the combination of toxicity and radiation had rendered him incapable of speech, writing, mobility or bowel control. Nobody ever discovered whether it was a prank, an attempted theft (South African diamond mines style), deliberate suicide or had involved others in his class. Such sources are not difficult to find in colleges, building sites, air-frame manufacturers, live seed distributers hospitals and factories. Polonium-210 is used to neutralise the static charge developed in the manufacture of thin films, such as acetate. Rather than any grand or thoughtful conspiracy, it is more likely an act of savage and possibly stupid malice. There may be a message, an allusion to some previous event, perhaps the 1993 murder of a post-perestroika gangster-turned-oligarch with a lump of radioactive material in the headrest of his executive lounger. There is probably none. There is probably a trail of finely-filed Polonium all the way from the factory to London, and a very frightened poisoner with all the right symptoms (real or imagined).

by iosaf Sat Dec 02, 2006 15:38

the KGB defector whose death has sparked a espionage media fest is the first person to have been murdered with Polonium in history.

And only the second person to die from it since Madame Curie named it. The last person was ( I hope this interests you as one with knowledge of isotopes & stuff) one of her laboratory assitants who like the person you tried to interview ingested the stuff accidently.

What does this tell us?

1) don't work for a Curie.
2) use proper scientific methods, protective wear & contact your local trade union to ensure safety mechanisms are in place & observed.
3) A "Polonium murder" of anyone, especially an ex KGB agent & FSB defector linked to known individuals on the international arms components black market is news-worthy & does indeed merit conspirational analysis.

& so I'm sticking with my theory that the very substance used is significant & was intended to send as clear a message as for example any ritualised assasination by more traditional mafia organisations be they Latin American cartels, Itallo-Americans or Japanese. But one thing is certain, scientific analysis of the Polonium in the bodies of the contaminated (so far one dead) will show impurities which trace the batch back to production. & you don't have to be Sherlock Holmes of the Yard to know that - that little bit of intelligence came from the Russian FSB statement. So I remind you all of my comment on the "bluff" & "chess. We are all watching a message we don't properly understand being communicated & it has taken in a Dublin restaurant & my local airport. Fascinating stuff. They should make a movie about it someday.

by Correction Sat Dec 02, 2006 16:29

The simplest solution is often right - personal jealousy, a business deal gone awry, a jilted lover, or lover's jilted lover. Never underestimate petty squabbles, they are the motivation for most crime. This is a bunch of spoiled, self-regarding chatteratti with nothing better to do than drop names and slight one another.

Russia (the probable origin of the Polonium) produces tens of grams a year for industrial use. An industrial source would require replacement every 5 years or so. Why pay the hazardous waste charge when an old enemy could swallow it? Unfortunately there is only one Russian producer, so the isotope contamination will not reveal anything apart from age. But how do you get someone to ingest a source embedded in a metallic carrier? Probably grind it down with emery paper or convert it to a solluble salt, either of which is undetectable if you aren't looking for it (airports detect gamma). The not-so-clever-as-(s)he-thinks poisoner is probably surface contaminated, certainly judging by the amount of contamination elsewhere, and quite possibly ingested from skin too.

by iosaf Sun Dec 03, 2006 15:54

So let's recap.

* Up above is a picture taken of Blair & Putin together with Putin's pet dog strolling along behind them. It was indeed taken at one of their pally summits as part of the g8 club. It also followed deportations & arrests made in Russia of English types accused of hiding eavesdropping equipment in fake rocks & planting fake trees. We can imagine that Putin's doggy, Blacky is well chipped up & never gets lost. Cheap to feed & you only change the batteries every 200,000 years.

The previous contributor "correction" has revealed to us lay-types some of the world of "handling dangerous isotopes" & reminded us of the axioms of homocide investigation :- the order of suspects are always - they who find the body & the next of kin. working from partners to jilted. Unless radioactive material of that type is brought close to the scene of the crime in protective equipment the person carrying it will receive a lethal dose too.

There are over 33,000 passenger records relating to the 3 Polonium contaminated British Airways flights. Just remember that Litvinenko didn't die under his real name, he had been admitted to hospital under one of his "working titles". 2 of those "passenger working titles" released by the BBC were UK Culture Secretary Tessa Jowell and UK bid Olympics chief Lord Coe who travelled on one of the aircraft to Barcelona (where I live) [ I wouldn't accept food from them.]

It is really worth remembering that only 2 people have been known to die from Polonium since Curie named it. The first was a lab.assistant employee of Curie & Curie Ltd. But we will never know how many people have been murdered by the Spooks Inc. of this world using radioactive material. Strontium seemed to the favourite of the Stassi who without having to deal with "metal casing" just sprayed the stuff on their dissidents or not even going that far - painted the floors of dissident meeting places with it. Thereafter they were easy to find using a Geiger counter & died quicker but for all appearances "naturally" from cancer.

Here's "aunty Beeb" Blair's state news service the BBC are reporting the Russians reporting all this "panic in London"
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/6199676.stm

Meanwhile the shift of attention to Italy is really worthy of comment.
Scaramella is adament there are illictly abandoned Soviet nuclear warheads in Italian national waters. http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/6201276.stm
This wouldn't really be so surprising - there are illicitly dumped nukes all over the European shop & we even have a few "officially recognised" sites. The Palomares site has just been re-opened to assessment 40 years after the USAF crashed a nuclear bomber B52 with four 1.5 megaton H-bombs aboard in those shallow waters in the morning of March the 16th 1966. http://es.wikipedia.org/wiki/Incidente_de_Palomares The reaction of the time was quite endearing, Manuel Fraga did his best to reassure tourists to Franco's Spain that the water was safe & allowed journalists photo him taking a dip with the US ambassador. It emerged years later that they had agreed to mis-inform the public of the precise crash site & yes the water they were seen dipping in was "safeish". You probably remember Fraga from such eco-delights as the Prestige (which is still leaking) by the way. [ c/f my Sunday Papers special on how democracy saw him finally leave office in 2005 http://www.indymedia.ie/newswire.php?story_id=70326 though he's still the oldest politician in the EU along with our own Paisley.]

But without exploring "NATO" mis-adventures & question the efficacy of clean-up & rescue operations of "lost" nuclear ordinance or equipment - let's just remember that all the Soviet nuclear submarines touched on in the "Polonium" media fest relied on the incredibly efficient Canary Bird or Brown Rat in a cage alarm system. If that animal died - the crew were in shite. Anyone who has seen the US Hollywood propaganda movie "K19" will also know the Soviet regime was not that forthcoming over where its crews died, sank or narrowly escaped only to die slowly afterwards. That movie was subtitled "the widowmaker". http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/K-19:_The_Widowmaker We can only presume the Soviet nuclear fleet left many such widows & orphans. Probably more of such than Litvinenko had jilted lovers.

So finally if "correction" (the previous commentator) is right - & it was a jilted lover or some insignificant criminal who happened on Polonium on the off chance & considering they haven't been arrested yet - they must be fascinated where all this leading.

between the Devil & the Dark Blue Sea

because only a week ago everyone talked about Anna Politkovskaya & They don't have submarines in Chechnya, I doubt they even have enough salt water for Sushi bars.

Submarine crews used to wait to surface & smoke their cigarette. Once they cleared Gdansk the Baltic was theirs'

by Correction Sun Dec 03, 2006 16:26

I am no fan of Putin, but a recap of his rather witty (and apparently off-the-cuff) remarks at the July G8 summit in St Petersburg indicates strong motive for the Russian spy news coverage:

To Mr George Bush: "We certainly would not want to have the same kind of democracy that they have in Iraq, quite honestly."

To Mr Ehud Olmert: "Greetings to your president, I would never have expected this [rape] from him. He surprised us all. We all envy him."

To Mr Tony Blair: "There are also other questions. Questions, let's say, about the fight against corruption. We'd be interested in hearing your experience, including how it applies to Lord Levy."

It doesn't help with the murder though, but here is some interesting reading:
http://www.newscientist.com/article/mg14019030.700-mafi....html
http://www.dhushara.com/book/explod/nuclears/nuc.htm
http://www.jamestown.org/publications_details.php?volum...d=702
http://www.bits.de/NRANEU/NonProliferation/docs/smuggli...s.htm
http://www.law.duke.edu/shell/cite.pl?8+Duke+J.+Comp.+&+Int'l+L.+79