Shinner Ard Fhéis

by Confused Sun Feb 29, 2004 21:29

Then what are you doing defending Mr. Scappaticci?

by observer Sun Feb 29, 2004 21:27

Nor do we care what a tout ridden gangs of hoods thinks

by Confused Sun Feb 29, 2004 19:33

The Provos are not Sinn Féin, "observer". They broke the constitution of that organisation in 1986, yet persist in using the proud name "Sinn Féin" without authorisation. At least the Worker's Party, Fianna Fáil, Fine Gael/Cumann na nGaedheal etc. had the honesty and decency to change the names of their organisations when they abandoned Republicanism. I don't care what your Free State and pro-British party call themselves, as long as it's not Sinn Féin.

Long live the All-Ireland Republic!

by observer Sun Feb 29, 2004 19:16

We don't care what adherents of micro totalitarian marxist groups think about SF.

by Confused Sun Feb 29, 2004 16:21

How exactly are Provisional Sinn Féin going to remove partition and establish a Socialist Republic, ProvoSF Member?

The Provos have recognised the legitimacy of the Free State since 1986, claiming that the majority of the people in the 26-Counties recognise Leinster House as a legitimate institution. Following the poor logic of that argument, the majority of the voters in the Occupied Six Counties recognised Stormont and Westminster as legitimate institutions (and of course the Provos signed up to the Stormont Agreement and entered the Stormont Assembly). So when are they going to sit in Westminster (which they already have offices in, at Stg £106,000 p.a.)? And join up to the Policing Board of the Continuity RUC?

Don't forget that Gerry also said on RTÉ last year that the Free State Army was the only lawful army in the State. Does this mean that the British Crown Forces are the only lawful army in the Six County state?

Waken up and take your blindfold off, Provo Member.

by Beck 44_syNtax_deleted Sun Feb 29, 2004 11:55

new sinn fein = old sinn fein

in it for the money (be it from coca-cola or from post offices)

by Saoirse Sat Feb 28, 2004 13:09 Derry

They may pass any number of very left-wing motions, but the leadership will ignore them if they are any way awkward. For example, two or three years ago, left-wingers in Derry SF passed a resolution at the Ard Fheis committing the party to opposition to support for jobs from any multinational companies that is involved in the arms trade OR did not allow trade unions. Three years later, once the SDLP were also in support, they produce a wishy-washy motion on Raytheon, the third largest arms manufacturer in the world but virtually ALL the jobs coming to Derry [and the rest of the North] these days are non-union or even anti-union. New Labour, New Sinn Fein!

by JMcK Sat Feb 28, 2004 05:59

The Ard Fheis will be televised live on Saturday, from 11.00am - 1.00pm (I think) and the Presidential Address at 5.00pm.

slan

by Wait and See Sat Feb 28, 2004 01:04

and wait and see what the attitude of the leadership is to these motions and if they will actually be passed. If they are passed it will be interesting to see what the leadership of SF will do, will they just ignore them like all the others do?

by Mary Fri Feb 27, 2004 18:21

I heard that De Brun actually underspent her budget and that she left office with hospital waiting lists actually HIGHER than when she took up office!

As for McGuiness he spent his whole time privatising education through Private Finance Initiatives! And they call themsevles socialist...

by Omagh Hospital Fri Feb 27, 2004 17:43

Could anyone in Sinn Fein explain how de Briun's time in health in any way advanced the socialist cause in NI? or McGuinnesses in education?

they did nothing socilaistic at all, indeed de Briun seemed to spend her time looking to close local hospital serives. some sociallist she

by SF Member Fri Feb 27, 2004 17:37

A raft of literature and pontification on SF lack of socialist credentials and the fabled left / right split have been flung at the party for decades..as the party looks at being the only political party in the position to force change in Ireland...
Whatever.. the theorists and arm chair revolutionaries will never achieve what this party has already gained and are a long way from offering to the working class people a solution to the failed class politics of partition..the only darkside I see is that which uses the arguements of revolution to demean and criticise the only revolutionary movement in current Irish politics.

by Eyes peeking through hand Fri Feb 27, 2004 17:27

Doesn't look like it from here.
See you after the split, by my guess a few years off but the left/right split will happen. Just hope you haven't gone over to the darkside by then.

by SF Member Fri Feb 27, 2004 17:21

That Connolly quote well used...yes SF do want to change the over riding bloc to the move towards class politics which is partition.
As Marx rightly pointed out dealing with the national oppressor is the first step..then dealing with the national bourgeoise..

Connolly died for a worker's republic..Sinn Fein is on the road to establishing one and the first stage is independence and national democracy..

by Hand over eyes Fri Feb 27, 2004 16:42

"Irish republicans are at the coal face of revolution by challenging the political structures of the 26 counties, the sx counties and the interference by a partisan British state in our affairs...that for me is left wing."

Oh I pity you, the puppies will feed at the trough of this poor analysis.

Connolly (James that is) said it best.
"If the only thing you do is pull down the Union Jack from over Dublin Castle and replace it with a green flag, you will have accomplished nothing. "

by Jonah Fri Feb 27, 2004 16:40

Conor makes a couple of good points, and there are motions from various Dublin Sinn Fein actually calling for oversight and reports on the implementation of Ard Fheis motions. I also think there are a couple of interesting documents coming out of this Ard Fheis on neutrality and poverty. The poverty document for example puts the blame for poverty on neo-liberal and market driven politics that are accepted by the establishment parties

http://www.sinnfein.ie/pdf/SFArdFheis04Poverty.pdf

I find it interesting that one poster attacks SF for attending the WEF and claiming, without a shred of evidence but when has that ever stopped anyone, that SF Trade Union members back Partnership. As both a Trade Unionists and an SF member I oppose it.

The key question here is if those motions are passed, boycotting the WF and opposing Partnership, will the individual inquestion come back here on Monday in a contrite manner?

Will he fuck.

by Sf Member Fri Feb 27, 2004 16:38

A united Ireland should have no fear for anyone, especially as the politics of SF are not to replace the sectarian nature of the six counties for a sectarian thirty two.

So save your arm bands and googles for engaging with your fellow citizens of ireland..jump on in..over eighty years of partition has failed..

Of course the change in society we are fighting for is the end of the fascistic partionist politics of N.ireland.

Right wing leadership ? , it is a revolutionary act to end partition this leadership is committed to that..so how right wing are they ? Irish republicans are at the coal face of revolution by challenging the political structures of the 26 counties, the sx counties and the interference by a partisan British state in our affairs...that for me is left wing.

by sf-watch Fri Feb 27, 2004 16:03

There is a small number of left wing workignclass activists in SF, I think that is clear to anyone. But SF is lead by a right wing pro capitalist leadership. Adams was over at the WEF recently in an attempt to court big business over to the north, their leading trade unionists support partnership and are part of the bueacracy, their councillors have patchy records on bin tax (Mark Daly, sligo etc). While in the NI exec they attacked the working conditions of term time workers, privitised schools and made moves to close the Omagh hospital.

I would say to the genuine activists in SF that they need to organise an opposition to their leadership in order to take the party away from the right wing and move it cleary in the direction of socialism.

I relly can't see this happening in the medium term at all though. I think on the whole the membership are quite happy with the right wing Adams/McGuiness leadership. Sf will not in my opinion reflect the changes in society but will instead attempt to follow them, It will take a serious movement in society to split SF on class lines.

by conor (wsm personal capacity) Fri Feb 27, 2004 16:02

Look at the motions on the Clár


BUT make your judgement on the ones that actually get passed and especially those that commit the group to doing anything specific and within a time scale!

this is a good rule of thumb with any party/union conference

Conor

by northern working class prod Fri Feb 27, 2004 15:58

i can't swin will i be given goggles and armbands when im marched to the end of belfast harbour and told to swin to Scotland??

by SF Member Fri Feb 27, 2004 15:51

It should not surprise anyone that these motions exist on the clar.
Look at the motions from previous Ard Fheis and you will find the grass root socialism which Sinn Fein promotes; with motions promoting equality, economic democracy and international solidarity to those engaged as the party is in revolutionising society.

Democracy in Ireland will be achieved by removing partition and establishing a socialist republic.

Have a good Ard Fheis comrades.