Shadows Tour 2008

by RAGAMUFFIN Fri Jan 18, 2008 22:43

I am disappointed as my mind interpreted your heading as a reference to The Shadows and Hank Marvin ;-) ooh wrong again!

by Prince Omar Sat Jan 19, 2008 18:10

No its nothing got to do with that dude you mentioned :)

But do try to come to some the talks

Peace out :)

by FatherCrow Wed Feb 13, 2008 16:34

I'm always suspicious of those who claim to know, and here I quote "'The Real Renaissance", "Russia's real objective", etc etc, people who know things for a surety, generally know little, thinking that there is only one immutable unchageable perspective, rather than probabilities. Also knowing the "real" reason for something many times becomes a problem when new information that counters the current reason surfaces, that information when introduced to someone who features "faith" and "belief" highly in their personality makeup, I find, has a tendency to be discarded to protect the original model.

Also, all this "truth" coming from a Moslem convert (much like a born again Christian, who generally try to behave "more Christian" than Christians) makes me a little suspicious. l'll listen to the Moslem perspective once the Moslem community acknowlege the potential validity of other perspectives (that said the same goes for other monotheistic religions) .

Remember people, a disciple is just an asshole looking for a real person to latch onto.

One last thought, been given the "real reason" for anything is a closed statement, and does not encourage discussion.

Still, go along, make your own decision, I could be wrong, as I'm not 100% sure of anything.

Peace and Hope

FatherCrow

by Lightuponlight Sat Feb 16, 2008 17:15

So you just said something that you are not sure if its right?

Ok then come to the talks and then make up ur mind, people are either right or wrong in some cases and history is one of them.

by Sceptic Sat Feb 16, 2008 23:56

It is well to recall the notable achievement of Islamic civilizations back then. At the time these were well ahead of Western Europe. This is the theme of Bernard Lewis the influential expert on Islam. However Islam has produced almost nothing of civilizational value for over three centuries. Its most notable recent inventions have been airplane hijacking and suicide belts. Islam has never been innovative or developmental when it has been fundamentalist. It was pluralist in the middle ages as it was during much of the Ottoman period. Also the geography of the Mediterranean itself lends itself to civilized discourse and trade, exchange of ideas and the like. Arguably Islamic Spain was primarily Mediterranean rather than Islamic. By contrast the dark and ruinous creed of wahabism emerged in the middle of the vast desert of Arabia. The former was about building and learning. The terror variants of the latter are about destroying the achievements of others like on 9/11, hatred, cruelty and intolerance. Islam is the father of each of these opposite tendencies. That is its paradox. The US, in encouraging democracy in the Muslim world in the wake of the attacks, had the idea to promote the good form of Islam and eclipse the bad.

by Real Renaissance Sun Feb 17, 2008 00:09

Well Bernard Lewis is clearly a foolish man.

Why not try Karen Armstrong? or even classical scourse like Tabari or Waqadi?

Or event better why not come to the Talk and find out how Muslims advanced mankind and liberated the jews from an anti semintic church controlled spain.

Thank you