Montreal Climate Deal is Historic Step Forward

by Michael Mon Dec 12, 2005 20:11

Thanks for the update Oisin! Would you be able to comment on a few things for us:
(a) What was the Irish government's position at the summit?
(b) Has the Irish government proposed what -- besides 'flexmex' -- it can do to get Ireland off the leaderboard of greenhouse gas polluters per person?
(c) Has FOE Ireland a view on the matter?

by BANANAMAN Tue Dec 13, 2005 13:21

Come on, you say in the piece that it is a very weak deal, so is it not a step sideways when we have to move forward? OK, so you're right when you say its historic, but only because it took place and will be recorded, but as for being truly meaningful, it certainly doesn't sound like it. I'm sure those folks in Canada who are witnessing the shrinking of the glaciers and the associated problems with their hydroelectric stations etc. are far from pleased. It seems to me like everyone is happy to keep the status quo, and procrastinate until we all melt.
"But concerns remain about what this (agreement) includes and what will be delivered.", damn right, I'm seriously concerned, all I think will be delivered will be another summit where people will talk about how we need to change our ways, and the perhaps after that we'' have another summit where people will talk about the need to change our ways, etc.etc. As far as I can see, not to many governments are going to compromise their economic development to address climate change in any meaningful way until they get a wake up call from mother nature, and the way shes doing it at the moment is just too slow for those with dollar/euro signs in their eyes to see. In my most humble opinion, we're on a slippery slope to global climate catastrophe, unless we did something major to address it, and that should have been done already. I fully support the efforts of the groups that were present, FOE etc., but surely you can see more clearly than anyone else where we're headed, and it ain't pretty.

by Shipsea Tue Dec 13, 2005 13:40

You leave the power of ordinary people to effect change out of the equation, bananaman. Individuals need to lead by example themselves. Make your home as eco friendly as you can. Dont buy food with excessive packaging. Dont buy things you dont need. Dont buy things you know are responsible for heavy pollution. Dont buy 'throwaway' products. Cycle to work. Walk the children to school. Establish car-share schemes. Put on a jumper instead of turning up the heating. Switch off all electric appliances when they are not in use - dont leave things on stand-by etc etc etc. There are thousands of things we can easily do to make a real difference. The critical mass you are looking for won't be reached until ordinary people demand it. Our current excesses will need to become a source of shame - wasteful habits to become as socially unacceptable as smoking now is. There are hundreds of websites with advice for people who want to change their lifestyle to a more eco friendly one. We should have a naming and shaming competition: and annual roll call of the people with the most apparently wasteful lifestyles. Do the same for businesses.

Waste should be re-established as the cardinal sin it once was.

by BANANAMAN Tue Dec 13, 2005 17:48

That the critical mass you speak of is nowhere near being a reality. I agree that we should all do the things that you mention, of which I personnally do quite a few, but the fact of the matter is that most people don't give a toss (I reckon). Most folks out there are far more concerned with what they're getting for Xmas, and how much they are going to drink, rather than how they are going to persuade their fellow man to stop wasting our resources. I bring this up every time I am out with friends, and they do tend to agree that we have to do something, but very few are actually prepared to make even the smallest sacrifice. All the things that you suggest are great, if everyone were to do them, but that is certainly not the case. Don't get me wrong, I want the planet to be saved too, but I get very depressed when I try to think of what is going to get people to change, f*ck all except a nuclear war or global climate catastrophe.
You said "The critical mass you are looking for won't be reached until ordinary people demand it", but thats the problem, ordinary people are not going to demand it anytime soon. Its ok for the middle classes to have these great ideas about energy saving, waste prevention etc., but most folks won't change the way they live. I salute your optimism, but realistically, I would say that it is, or its certainly possible, that we, and our planet, are gone beyond saving, sad I know, but you think we can be saved, rose coloured glasses IMHO, imagine believing that we are screwed.
Perhaps the people wil rise, perhaps disrespect for the environment will become a burning issue for the masses, but I don't think so.
And BTW, smoking hasn't really become socially unacceptable. I smoke, and so ok, its illegal to smoke in any place of work, including pubs, but people don't exactly spit at you in the street if you're having a fag (don't get me started on butts on the ground either). Its known that smoking is bad for you, and shouldn't be promoted, but it has quite a way to go before it is socially unacceptable to the degree that smokers would stop for that reason. I would say that illegal dumping is more socially unacceptable at this stage, but it still occurs on a massive scale.