"Make Poverty History" History becaue they didn't address the war!

by Dave Fri Jul 08, 2005 20:51

"Other G8 protests have achieved nothing to date bar an increased security and insurance bill, and some nice pics for little activists to feel special about."

Rubbish Adam. The protests at G8 summits, World Trade Organisation events and World Economic Forum summits are exactly what have put these issues on the agenda. Without these protests, people worldwide wouldn't be casting such a critical eye on neo-liberalism, the World Bank, IMF etc.

by R. Isible Fri Jul 08, 2005 19:30

QUOTE: it's proven far more effective in being an agenda setting item, raising awareness, focusing minds etc than any of the completely ineffective demonstrations done by the left in seattle, dublin, genoa etc.

And you can support that statement how? Bono/Geldof are the co-option of a rising amount of discontent and self-organisation that became publically visible in Seattle and has continued on since then. All that Bono/Geldof are succeeding in doing is reducing the pressure on the G8/WorldBank/IMF by conning people into thinking that something is being done.

In any event your assertion above needs a metric of some sort to back it up. I don't believe it and I'd be fascinated to see something to support such an authoritative and clear statement.

by Michael Fri Jul 08, 2005 15:37

Good points Adam.

Where you live? If in Dublin you should come along to the Eye witness report on protests and events at G8 Summit in Edinburgh on tonight at 8pm in the Carmelite Community Centre, Whitefriar St. (after Georges St) D2.

Big topic will be - where to from here??

See this site:-

http://www.indymedia.ie/newswire.php?story_id=70456

by Adam Fri Jul 08, 2005 12:52

For the left's ideals to be adopted by the mainstream, the mainstream need to feel that not just the goals but the actions of the 'project/party/propsoals' (etc) are something they can buy into.

It's only an opinion, but I'd see the reason why africa and poverty are on this G8 agenda to a degree not previously seen, is because the mainstream media/voters feel they can buy into and embrace this cause and how it's being marketed in a way they would never feel about a cause like 'anti-capitalism' or 'anti-globalisation'.

You may feel that not mentioning the war etc, or the methods cheapen the cause. I doubt many African would give a toss how it happens, as long as it does. MPH might just be a bandwagon to jump on, but who cares as long as it can deliver something? Other G8 protests have achieved nothing to date bar an increased security and insurance bill, and some nice pics for little activists to feel special about.

I'm not defending the governments, I'm defending the logic behind this campaign and the slightly depressing irish trait we have of trying to knock people down who dare to try and make a difference.

My point was that geldof and bono could do an oasis and go spend their money and not give a toss, but instead try and use their fame and influence towards a cause everyone would agree is worthy.

You might think there's better ways, noiseir ways, ways that make you feel better because it's more idealistic, but even if they only manage to pull off part of what they are trying, isn't that better than them not trying at all???

by Anonymous Fri Jul 08, 2005 11:50

Adam,

Do you think the governments of the world are doing the right thing? Do you think they could (relatively easily) stop killing / stop the killing of 30,000 people a day from poverty?

But I agree with your last point and I think it is important – i.e. “Governments will only move on issues when the mainstream move. You're nowhere near mainstream....”

It is important because:-

1. It indicates the direction to the solution of the world’s problems.

2. It indicates the moral culpability that the whole world has to the world’s problems. The people of the world are every bit as guilty as the governments that they elect and which we all single handedly point the finger at when things go wrong. The people must wake up. We must de-elect the governments that are destroying the planet. We must wake them up.

Regards,

Michael.

by adam Fri Jul 08, 2005 10:20

You know, some of you muppets should really cop on and realise that your narrow view of the world and snide remarks are just thta, snide remarks on a forum thats virtually impossible to take seriously when opinion is purported as news.

I'm not a big U2, I think Bono is an overrated singer and Geldof never impacted my life but i respect them for what they are trying to do.

In a recent interview Bono was asked about the iraq war and why he was so silent about it. his answer? He saw the issue of Africa as by far the biggest issue of his time and felt by focusing on that one issue and not getting sidetracked, he had a better chance of achieving his goals.

Now, you might not agree with it, but it's a perfectly valid point of view and it's much easier to sell the idea when you're not hammering the people you're looking for favours (call it what you want, he's asking for something without offering anything himself in return) from apart from feeding off 'celebritism'.

Sometimes you have to deal with people you don't like to get a resolution you want. But then again, opportunism and not pragmatism seem to be the preserve of inhabitants here.

I find it rather heartening that people like Geldof and Bono, when so wealthy and with so many other possible uses for their time, decide to dedicate it to what they feel, is a cause that would make a difference.

When you can make a million a night at a gig, your time is worth a hell of a lot, and isn't is just a slight bit refreshing to see someone at least attempting to put their celebrity to good use, rather than milking it to go on love islands and big brothers?

Bono etc know they're being used, they've accepted that as the trade off for hopefully pressuring countries into making a real difference. Although some the camera totting summit tour junkies might hate to agree, it's proven far more effective in being an agenda setting item, raising awareness, focusing minds etc than any of the completely ineffective demonstrations done by the left in seattle, dublin, genoa etc.

Governments will only move on issues when the mainstream move. You're nowhere near mainstream....