Two Hells.

by bewildered Tue Aug 17, 2004 12:09

You joined the PDs because you thought they were a protest movement???

In all fairness, I reckon that is was you and not they who lost their way.

It would be interesting all the same to explore the origins of the party and in particular the large donation (£100,000?) that set them up and for which they have never accounted. This money may have come from the same source that put up the money to bribe Government Ministers like MacSharry to get rid of Haughey. Various guesses as to who might have been responsible.

by Sean Crudden Tue Aug 17, 2004 11:58 0879739945

When I wrote the story at the head of the thread here I was not really writing about the PDs and so I find it interesting that the very first comment (from Michael Hennigan) was about this aspect of the story and it was re-echoed in one of the following comments.

As readers of indymedia may be aware I have been a member of the PDs since about 1987.

In the early days it was a kind of protest movement. Dessie O’Malley - the first leader - set out to "break the mould" of Irish politics as it existed in the middle to late 80’s. O’Malley, all through his days of leadership carried at least some trace of a "chip" on his shoulder and there was always the underlying idea that he was "agin" something. I must admit that that side of his personality always appealed to me.

However even in those days the party quite quickly assumed the air of a "yuppie" party. Frankly even though I often thought about it I do not know how this happened. Perhaps it had something to do with the class background of O’Malley himself or of some of the other leading lights in the party around the time of the late 80’s or early 90’s. For some reason the name Pat Cox comes to mind (he was General Secretary of the party in the early days).

Mary Harney has been leader of the party for over 10 years now. She was an acolyte of O’Malley’s when the party was founded but the whole animus of the party has become more moribund in her reign. National Party Conferences have become less frequent and less participative. Whereas party conferences in the late 80’s and early 90’s were lively with lots of motions and plenty of authentic debate and an enjoyable social atmosphere, this year’s conference - before the local elections - was a disgracefully stage-managed affair.

I do not know how the situation has arisen where Mary Harney and Micheal McDowell seem to delight in wearing Margaret Thatcher’s old clothes. Frankly I must confess I never liked those clothes even when Maggie herself was wearing them.

As I suggested in my original story, despite apparent political constipation at the moment, things inevitably change and where we are now is only a staging post for the future. It should be remembered that not all change is gradual - there can often be remarkable discontinuities and jumps.

by Yob Thu Aug 12, 2004 18:27

This is possibly the worst story I have ever had the misfortune to read.

What are you saying Sean? That there were two articles in the Irish Times that caught your eye? Did you think that this was of such value that you just had to share it?

You think you know what the writer is talking about? Are you brain dead? Really are you? Every single person in the world knows what the writer is talking about, outdated opinion about how it's a man's world and if you don't drink 15 pints and play golf you're fucked. Great.

Then your venerable opinion on the evil empire and the right wingers who are 'basically weak-minded and cowardly people'. Great analysis, Dick Cheney never struck me that way. He's a dick maybe but weak-minded? You got to be weak to be strong is that it? Like Jesus? Now there's a good guy and strong but weak, yeah.

Then the holiday story, you're a real world traveller. Thanks for that.

Next time keep it to yourself.

by Fergal Wed Aug 11, 2004 16:29

This kind of crap has been all over the Times since they gave the editor's job to Kennedy, a founder member of the PDs.

by Michael Hennigan Wed Aug 11, 2004 14:55

In Ireland the PD's may claim to be the party of private enterprise etc etc but it seems to me that the party does not have an ideology.

PD Minister Tom Parlon is a farmer with two thirds of his income provided by a form of public welfare. Michael McDowell's profession operates a closed shop type system that trade unionists could only dream of and Mary Harney's family background is also in farming.

The party jumped on the Thatcher bandwagon in the 1980's but apart from cheerleading for lower taxes, what else does it stand for? Competition? Deregulation? The taxi industry was an easy target but apart from EU mandated deregulation, what has Harney achieved? The fact that she is awaiting a report from a group on consumer policy after 7 years in governmnent, to provide a policy response to 'Rip Off Ireland' speaks volumes.