Cindy Sheehan Speeks

by Dan Sat Dec 10, 2005 17:02

why are you charging in?

by Desperate Dan Sun Dec 11, 2005 13:53

Just a wild guess- maybe its cause we live in a capitalist economy and to have a venue, accomodation for speakers etc can cost money.
Sounds pretty simple to me.

by Mike Mon Dec 12, 2005 13:04

pretty steep

by Spartacus Mon Dec 12, 2005 13:15

€10 is a bit much to charge into a public meeting. If the money was going to Cindy Sheehan to advance her work I would not really quibble. But the truth is that the profits from the night will go to the SWP front, the IAWM. A another little help for RBB.

by Tom Mon Dec 12, 2005 16:33

Great it steep- its all going to swp, or maybe rbb is going to skip the country with it.
So while others watch Cindy speak Spartacus will be at home with his playstation.

by Spartacus Mon Dec 12, 2005 17:03

I might have a quiet night in. I will attend the Pro Choice Protest at Dail earlier in the day so that will salve my conscience. I certainly dont want any of my money going to advance the interests of the SWP or the election of RBB. Its a pity Cindy has fallen into such bad company.

by Kieran O'Sullivan - IAWM Tue Dec 13, 2005 13:16 kieran.osullivan at ireland dot com

Normally I do not respond to negative comments placed on web sites (especially by people who do not have the courage to put their names on them or any contact details)
However on this occasion a very damaging and outrageous allegation has been made and I have to answer it.

The cost of the venue is 2,000 euro and believe me we looked hard to get that price.

The cost of flights, hotels, food, etc is running close to 900 euro. (Members of the IAWM steering Committee have paid all of this in advance)

The IAWM would be very happy to put this meeting on for free but as was pointed out we live in an expensive country and we simply can't do that.

The allegation that the money is going to Richard's election campaign is outrageous!

If anyone wishes to contact me further concerning this issue please e-mail me at kieran.osullivan@ireland.com or treasurer@irishantiwar.org
Ring after 5pm on 0876187680

Kieran O'Sullivan
Treasurer
Irish Anti-War Movement

by Spartacus Tue Dec 13, 2005 14:09

I am prepared to accept the details you have outlined here and the relevant costs. However in the past the IAWM used an account which was also used by the SWP hence the suspicion. This was a really expensive venue. You could have hired the ATGWU hall or one of the larger lecture theatres in TCD for a small fraction of what you paid for the O'Reilly hall.

by Kieran O'Sullivan - IAWM Wed Dec 14, 2005 10:42 kieran.osullivan at ireland dot com

Firstly on the venue TCD do not allow advertising of their venue outside of TCD. So it would be difficult to build such a meeting.

As to the claim that the IAWM once used an account which the SWP used well if you can provide proof of this please contact me because I would love to see it!

by Wondering Wed Dec 14, 2005 10:54

Kieran how did the meeting go?

by ? Wed Dec 14, 2005 11:28

Kieran can we have a report of the meeting

by Spartacus Wed Dec 14, 2005 11:37

I am trying to find the story at the moment. I know it appeared on Indymedia. I am trying to work out a search string to find the joint account story. There are many many stories which include both the SWP and IAWM>

by Wondering Again Wed Dec 14, 2005 11:42

Is there anyone who was at the meeting that can give a report?

by What Wed Dec 14, 2005 13:51

3000 euro to listen to an hour or two of speeches. How much was collected at the meeting.

by odd Wed Dec 14, 2005 15:33

How is it the SP flew a guy over from Brazil to speak ata public meeting on Latin America which would have cost a fair few quid and they didn't levy a cover charge.

It seems to me the SWP are trying to make an easy few quid instead of actually doing some real fundraising.

by Kieran O'Sullivan - IAWM Wed Dec 14, 2005 18:04 kieran.osullivan at ireland dot com

Firstly I am not a member of either the SP or SWP (fundamental problem with revolutionary socialism IT DOESN’T WORK) so I can assure anyone here that the IAWM do not give anyone else money unless they do work for us (most of our bills are for printing).

As to how the SP could fly a guy over from Brazil well that may have to do with the fact that Joe Higgins gives most of his salary to the SP. However I would have no problem paying into an SP meeting to hear someone speak.

How much money was collected last night well if you send me your e-mail address and you are in the IAWM database I will tell you. You have to pay a subscription fee to join the IAWM 5.00 euro so as soon as I get that I'll tell you.

I am working during the day so I can't put up a proper report on the meeting. It was reasonably well attended and all the speakers were excellent. Overall the Cindy Sheehan visit was very successful. We managed to get a lot of media coverage. If the Dubksy judgement had gone the right way it would have been the brilliant however that wasn’t likely.

As to the claim that there is a story on indymedia.ie about the IAWM using the same account as the SWP I think before you make a claim like that you should have the post to hand. Also it had better be from a person who had the courage to put their name on it. I will not accept as proof a story, which I can't verify.

I have said this before and I will say it again. Why can't people put up some proper contact details and use their correct name. Using handles leads to a situation where anyone even an extreme right wing group could put up posts.

I will finish with a quote from the Lord of the Rings

"Indeed in nothing is the power of the Dark Lord more clearly shown than in the estrangement that divides all those who still oppose him" Haldir in Lothlórien

by Mark P - Socialist Party (personal capacity) Wed Dec 14, 2005 18:23

Andre Ferrari, a leader of the Socialist Party's sister organisation in Brazil and a member of the executive of the new left wing party there, spoke in Dublin recently. It was a great meeting by the way and rammed full.

Someone above asked how the Socialist Party managed to hold that meeting without levying a cover charge. The answer is that firstly Andre didn't come to Europe simply for that meeting but for four meetings in Ireland and a whole series of events in other countries. Also collections were held at those meetings to cover the costs incurred. I don't know the ins and outs of the Irish Anti-War Movement's meeting with Cindy Sheehan but it may well be that one meeting had to cover all of the costs or that the costs were greater in the first place.

I do think that €10 is a lot to charge into a public meeting, but I'd still like to have gone because Cindy Sheehan is an important figure in the US anti-war movement. Whatever problems people have with the IAWM, the allegations and insinuations that they would misappropriate whatever money they manage to raise from the meeting is quite staggeringly nasty and really shouldn't be allowed to stay on the newswire without some kind of evidence. Political criticism is one thing, that kind of slur quite another.

by Fund raise! Wed Dec 14, 2005 19:00

The SP Latin American tour cost over €3000 just for Ireland and this money was raised by SP branches. The money that was collected at the meetings was given to our party in Brazil and not used to cover the costs of the tour.
Was the decision to charge €10 and €5 for the IAWM meeting influenced by the precedent set by the SWPs friend Galloway who charges for people to hear him speak?

by Michael Yn - IAWM Wed Dec 14, 2005 19:57

I am an occasional visitor to Indymedia - but I must say I am amazed at some of the absolutely schizophrenic commentary I saw just now following Cindy Sheehan's first-time visit to Dublin and last night's very successful meeting in O'Reilly Hall.
She was on the Pat Kenny Show interviewed by McGurk. She was on both the 6.00 and 9.00 o'clock News on RTE. She was in the Mirror, the Independent, the Times - she was interviewed by 102 FM and she spoke at a very large meeting in O'Reilly.
She spoke about the anti-war movement in the States, against Shannon. She spoke from her heart...along with Rose Gentle and two Iraqi comrades and Julie - an aunt of a dead soldier. Was it worth €5 for the nearly 200 unwaged or €10 for the waged who turned up? All 40 copies of her book were sold...does that tell a story?
She lifted our spirits, she made us new friends. A number joined the IAWM at the end. I realise how much this event cost the IAWM - and I know how much hard work must now be invested to make up the financial deficit.
The rest of the stuff raised by some of the completely brainless and virulent anti-SWPers leaves me cold...It's hard to imagine they care about Shannon or worry about the slaughter in Iraq. They think they're scoring points. For what and against whom?
My objective is to be part of a united anti-war movement that will mobilise tens of thousands against the war on March 18th. With the IAWM, with the Catholic workers, the Ploughs, with my friend Laurence and his lot, with Harry, with the young lady who hammered the US plane in Shannon, with our comrades who will be tried for the third time, with Richard and Jim and Kieran and the SWP, and the SP and Sinn fein and the Labour Party - and, of course, the Greens and CND and Amnesty....any objections?

by don rumsfeld - project for a new century of irish subjugation under my neo-neo-con jackboots Wed Dec 14, 2005 20:35

a hilarious headline.

as competent and compelling as the loonie show on parade.