The last of the Fatima 3 has died.

by mr a. Mon Apr 04, 2005 00:35

and the antichrist was obviously napoleon and neither hitler or stalin they came too late in the chronology, heck what are talking about cromwell was good candidate and what was the music Nero played on the violin?

of course this is what happens when over a fifth of the planet's population have been raised on the same belief system and watched pretty much the same TV.

the next week is going to be full of it.

by mr.p - fca Sun Apr 03, 2005 16:30

the attack of the man in white was obviously when the pope was shot

by Anne O'Hara - IIPG Thu Feb 17, 2005 18:46 oharaanne at eircom dot net

Our Lady in Medjugorje asked that we read a specific bible passage in Matthew each Thursday.

August 5, 1986
"Read each Thursday the Gospel of Matthew, where it is said: 'No one
can serve two masters.... You cannot serve God and money."

Matthew 6:24-34 :
No man can serve two masters. He will either hate one and love the
other or be attentive to one and despise the other. You cannot give
yourself to God and money. warn you, then: do not worry about your
livelihood, what you are to eat or drink or use for clothing. Is
not life more than food? Is not the bodymore valuable than clothes?

"Look at the birds in the sky. They do not sow or reap, they gather
nothing into barns; yet your heavenly Father feeds them. Are not
you more important than they? Which of you by worrying can add a
moment to his life-span?

As for clothes, why be concerned? Learn a lesson from the way the
wild flowers grow. They do not work, they do not spin. Yet I assure
you, not even Solomon in all his splendor was arrayed like one of
these. If God can clothe in such splendor the grass of the field,
which blooms today and is thrown on the fire tomorrow, will He not
provide much more for you, O weak in faith!

Stop worrying then, over questions like, 'What are we to eat, or
what are we to drink, or what are we to wear?' The unbelievers are
always running after these things. Your heavenly Father knows all
that you need. Seek first his kingship over you, his way of
holiness, and all these things will be given you besides. Enough,
then, of worrying about tomorrow. let tomorrow take care of
itself. Today has troubles enough of its own.

Concecration to the Immaculate Heart of Mary as dictated to Jelena
Vasilj from the Blessed Mother in Medjugorje. Pray daily

O most pure heart of Mary,
full of goodness, show your love towards us.
Let the flame of your heart, O Mary,
descend on all people.
We love you immensely.
Impress on our hearts true love
so that we long for you.
O Mary, gentle and humble of heart,
remember us when we sin.
You know that all people sin.
grant, that through your most pure.
and motherly heart,
we may be healed from
every spiritual sickness.
Grant that we may always experience
the goodness of your motherly heart,
and that through the flame of your heart, we may be converted. Amen

Prayer of consecration to the Most Sacred Heart of Jesus (Dictated
by our Lady to Jelena Vasilj). Pray daily.

O Jesus,
we know that you are gentle,
and that you have given your heart
for all of us.
It was crowned with thorns
and with our sins.
Oh, we know that nowadays you beg us
not to be lost.
Jesus,
remember us when we sin.
Through your most holy heart
give us grace to love each other.
Let hatred disappear from the people.
Show your love.
We all love you,
and wish you to protect us
with your shepherd's heart
from every sin.
Come into every heart, O Jesus,
knock, knock on our hearts.
Be patient and untiring.
We are still closed because
we have not yet understood your will.
Knock perseveringly.
O good Jesus, Make us open
our hearts to you,
at least when we remember
your passion endured for us. Amen

by - Wed Feb 16, 2005 10:34

is it not too much to ask of both those who had faith in Lucia and those who did not, to consider a moment that from the moment the little shepherd girl entered the carmelite convent till the moment she died, she was questioned, questioned, interrogated, probed, ordered.
Do not for a moment think it was easy for her.
"Now lets go through it again..." said nice priest, "what did the BVM say about the SWP?", "And what about the cheesemakers?" snarled nasty priest.
If there are any morals to be learnt, they are, if you see the BVM, stay quiet about it. And if you know the BVM schedule, ask her not to appear to in little towns with significant names like Fatima to small children tending their uncle's flock, because it's not helpful to anyone, ¿is it? For those of you who like this sort of thing, the link to the "3rd secret of Fatima" as released in 2000 by Cardinal Ratzinger was left by me in the address line of a comment to the "sunday papers" article I left nine days ago which dealt with the public interest in shanigins at the vatican and in the media when the Pope collapsed and twice rejected medical assistance.
You can find it, read it and see what you make of it.
It is allegorical. We seem to agree that if the BVM appears, she doesn't communicate with mortals in pithy sentances. It is probably most doubtful that she said -"russia will be converted", it is much more likely that the little children in "ecstasy" had a "vision" and thereafter it was compressed by the church into a "soundbyte". I for one don't think that the BVM if assumed incorruptible into heaven communicates when appearing on earth in "soundbytes".

But maybe I'm wrong.
anyway, one little nun has died, and was a focus for genuine devotion and much paranoia and conspiracy throughout her life. And I very much doubt she had a wonderful time of it. I don't imagine it was all chocolate biscuits and giggles.
May she rest in peace.

by R J Cyr Wed Feb 16, 2005 04:32

I wonder what will happen to us now, did not the Blessed Mother state to Sister Lucia "I will take you to heaven before the horrors of earth shall begin". Think about that one!

by Lizzy Wed Feb 16, 2005 01:22

so god is working for the corporate west now...

how come the bvm has never told some children that america should be helped to turn away from war, capitalism and the pursuit of profit?

by obit Tue Feb 15, 2005 22:07

Sister Lucia De Jesus Dos Santos, who died on Sunday aged 97, was the last of the three children said to have seen apparitions of the Virgin Mary outside the Portuguese town of Fatima in 1917.

Although the Roman Catholic Church is extremely wary of private revelations, several popes have indicated their personal acceptance of the authenticity of the appearances; in 1983, John Paul II beatified the two other children involved. Nevertheless, some commentators, usually outside the Church, have continued to question the authenticity of the miracles, while a tiny minority of Catholics has cast doubts on elements which have periodically been made public.

On six occasions between May and October 1917, Lucia claimed, the Virgin Mary appeared to her and her cousins, Jacinta and Francisco Marto, while they tended the family sheep. She urged them to pray the rosary daily for world peace and to bear their daily hardships as a sacrifice to ensure that sinners reached heaven.

A crowd of 50,000 arrived at Fatima on October 13 1917, the date of the final apparition - at which the Virgin had promised a "miraculous sign so that all may believe". Thousands claimed that they saw the sun turn red and spin violently on its axis, though others suggested they had merely witnessed an eclipse.

Exactly six months earlier, the Virgin had made her first appearance to the children as they played after lunch on a rocky slope. Seeing a flash of white light over a holm oak tree, they feared a thunderstorm, and were shepherding the flock downhill when they met a lady by the tree "shining white, brighter than the sun", as Lucia recorded in her memoirs.

Announcing that she was from heaven, the Virgin said that she would appear to them for six successive months, at the same place and on the same day each month, revealing her identity during the final vision.

Subsequently, she confided a terrible vision of hell "where poor sinners go", showing blackened souls floating in a fiery pool. If humanity did not repent, warned the Virgin, a second, more terrible war would break out.

This was the first of the Three Secrets of Fatima. The second predicted that Russia would return to Christianity and, in 1944, while gravely ill, Lucia sent a sealed envelope containing the contents of the Third Secret of Fatima to the Vatican, with strict instructions that it should not be opened before 1960.

The then Pope, John XXIII, announced that the secret did not concern him, and it mouldered in the Vatican vaults for a further 40 years. This prompted rumours that it contained an awful vision of the apocalpyse or referred to problems in the Church since the second Vatican Council. Such speculation even led a former Trappist monk to hijack an Aer Lingus plane in 1981, threatening to blow it up unless the secret was revealed.

When, in 2000, the Church finally disclosed that the secret consisted of an allegorical vision showing a bishop clad in white, who had been shot and was stumbling across a field strewn with corpses to reach the Cross, many were disappointed. Rumours of an undisclosed "third part of the third secret" abounded; but the Church suggested that the vision was a prophecy of the assassination attempt on John Paul II in St Peter's Square by a Turkish gunman in 1982; John Paul II himself attributed his salvation to the Virgin of Fatima, declaring "one hand fired and another hand guided the bullet away".

The next year, he placed the bullet in the crown of the Virgin of Fatima, the image of the Virgin in the Portuguese town; and, in 2000, the Pope beatified Francisco and Jacinta Marto, thus placing them on the path to sainthood. Both had died in childhood, as predicted by the Virgin during the 1917 apparitions. But she had told Lucia that her mission was to remain on earth to spread the Fatima message of prayer, penance and life conversion.

The seventh and last child of Antonio Dos Santos and Maria Rosa e Rosa, Lucia Dos Santos was born on March 22 1907 at Aljustrel, a hamlet of Fatima. Her earliest memories included learning the Hail Mary as her mother taught the prayer to her elder sister. Though her father was somewhat slack in his religious duties, Lucia's mother catechised and taught the Bible stories to most of the village children.

On feast days and festivals, Lucia's sisters would dress her in hats adorned with gold beads and fringed shawls and bring her to dances, where she would sing for the crowds. If there were a shortage of female partners, she would dance the waltz. However, on making her First Holy Communion at the age of seven, Lucia renounced such worldly pleasures, preferring instead to meditate on spiritual matters. She had plenty of opportunity when sent, that year, to shepherd the family sheep on land in Fatima. Soon she had her first vision of an angel, a rather blurred apparition resembling, she told her family, "somebody wrapped up in a sheet"; the description drew much teasing from her siblings.

While watching over the family sheep with her cousins the following year, Lucia saw another angel, this time resembling "a boy of great beauty, about 14 years old, whiter than snow, transparent as crystal when the sun shines through it". Announcing that he was "the Angel of Peace", the apparition taught the children prayers, showing them a vision of a chalice above which he held the Eucharist, which was dripping blood. He revealed, in two subsequent visions, that Jesus and Mary had special plans in store for them.

Despite this, it came as a shock when, on May 13 1917, the Virgin Mary appeared to the children over the oak tree. Before ascending to heaven, she opened her hands towards them and, Lucia later wrote, streams of light issued from her hands and appeared to pierce the children's chests. Having announced her reappearances, the Virgin asked for a church to be built on the Cova da Iria, the spot at which she appeared. She added that the First World War, then in its penultimate year, would soon end.

News of the apparitions spread quickly. Although Lucia had urged silence, six-year-old Jacinta found it impossible to say nothing. As Lucia suspected, trouble followed: all the children were interrogated together and separately by priests and a psychologist. Lucia was severely scolded by her mother, who threatened to beat her unless she confessed that the apparitions were a lie.

Shortly before the apparition in August, the regional adminstrator kidnapped the children and, in a series of separate interviews, threatened to boil them alive in oil if they did not deny the apparitions. When this failed, he cast them for a night into the county jail, where Francisco led the prisoners in prayer and Jacinta danced the fandango with a thief. The children interpreted these hardships as the suffering predicted for them by the Virgin Mary.

In the meantime, pilgrims were appearing at Fatima before the monthly apparitions, begging the seers to ask the Virgin for favours. Some 50,000 people were present on October 13 for the final vision, on a rainy morning. At about 1 pm the children arrived, and Lucia told the crowds to put away their umbrellas. Suddenly she shrieked "Look at the sun!", and members of the crowd later testified that it changed colour, and began to turn on its axis as though dancing, as it hurtled towards the earth. Lucia later revealed that, while the crowd witnessed the sun change colour, the seers witnessed visions of the Virgin Mary and also Jesus and Joseph in the sky.

Within five years, Lucia was the only seer still alive, and had gone, at the Virgin's suggestion, to learn to read and write at the village school. In 1923, her mother smuggled her out of Fatima and into the convent school of the nuns of the Institute of St Dorothy at Oporto. To disguise her identity, the nuns re-named her Maria das Dores.

By 1925, Lucia had entered their novitiate at Pontevedra, over the border in Spain, where she saw fresh visions of the Virgin and Child Jesus. In one, Mary told Lucia about a spiritual exercise she had mentioned at Fatima involving the faithful attending Mass on the first Saturday of each month for five consecutive months in order to offer prayers and sacrifice for the conversion of Russia. Later, the Child Jesus appeared to Lucia in the convent's backyard when she was taking out the rubbish, and urged her to spread this devotion throughout the world.

In 1929 the Virgin Mary instructed Lucia to tell the Pope about this and to ask him to say a special prayer, in union with every Catholic bishop in the world, consecrating the entire world - but especially Russia - to her immaculate heart. Only thus, said the Virgin, would Russia be prevented from spreading its errors (Communism).

When a letter from the Bishops' Conference of Portugal failed to elicit a papal response, Lucia's bishop and her spiritual confessor urged her to write a personal letter to Pope Pius XII. Despite strong misgivings, she complied, signing herself "the least of the daughters of the Church"; and, in 1942, the Pope made the consecration. However, he failed to ask the other Catholic bishops in the world to unite with him in prayer. In 1984, John Paul II repeated the consecration in Rome in union with the world's bishops. For years malcontents speculated that the consecration was incomplete; but in 1989, months after the fall of the Iron Curtain, Sister Lucia announced that "heaven" had accepted the Pope's 1984 consecration.

Since taking her final vows in 1928 Lucia, now known as Lucia de Jesus, had tried to keep a low profile in the convent, though she was constantly besieged by visitors. She wrote four separate accounts of the 1917 visions to satisfy her bishop and spiritual director, who guessed correctly that Lucia was suppressing the full story. In a letter attached to her fourth memoir, finished in December 1941, Lucia told her bishop that she had finally told all, and felt like a "skeleton stripped bare and put on exhibition in the museum of the world".

In March 1948 Sister Lucia transferred from the Institute of St Dorothy to the Convent of Carmel at Coimbra, Portugal, by special permission, and though never seen by the public, she would sometimes reply to written requests for prayer. In response to the deluge of questions and requests regarding Fatima, in 2000 Lucia wrote a 354-page book, Appeals of the Fatima Message, summarising the visions and their message.

by . Tue Feb 15, 2005 21:40

GOOD

by vvv Tue Feb 15, 2005 12:20

Its not bertie anyway, he prefers yellow.
Maybe we should try to get the shrub to wear white?

by jjr Mon Feb 14, 2005 19:18

the events in Yugoslavia (Medjugorje) have not been approved as they are still occurring daily. the Catholic church will not make a decision until the events have ended.

by pat c Mon Feb 14, 2005 18:38

Why not open bacon curing factories at these BVM apparition sites? It would probably attract some EU grants as well.

by J Mon Feb 14, 2005 18:16

"the last one, which dealt with an attack on a man in dressed in white"

So she foresaw the Jacko trial then?

I thought the third secret was kept secret?

by John Mon Feb 14, 2005 18:07

Her predictions seem to be a lot more accurate than those of the socialists and communists who thought the soviet system would last for all time and herald a new world order. People still go to Fatima, Lourdes and Knock. Not so many visit Marx's grave or Lenin's corpse these days, I'm afraid. The airports are irrelevant. These places drew millions of pilgrims annually long before the development of air travel.